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Post by Cyno on Aug 27, 2015 19:48:14 GMT -5
The mass media doesn't need to do any smear campaigning to make Gamergaters look bad when the average social media post using #gamergate does that well enough on its own. Unless you believe some dork from Gawker really has nothing else better to do than create hundreds of "false flag" Twitter accounts to smear whatever good name Gamergate members think it ever had.
That's the problem when there's no organization or really any desire to actively weed out toxic elements from your "movement": they take over and it's a giant snowball effect.
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Post by Jacy Derangement Syndrome on Aug 27, 2015 19:50:33 GMT -5
Wow, I can't believe it's been an entire year since I became completely embarrassed to call myself a gamer. I used to be so hardcore that MLG was my middle name and sometimes I bled Mountain Dew. Then Gamer Gate came along and I've been a filthy casual ever since.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Aug 27, 2015 19:51:33 GMT -5
F*** GamerGate.
Regardless of whether or not journalism ethics was the original intent, it's already been overtaken by a disgusting and misogynist sentiment. Once a (vocal) portion of its supporters/members were both actively harassing and doxxing people and/or were simply complacent towards it, I was done taking it seriously. If gamers truly do need a support group and some sort of identity to defend their favorite artform against attacks from the mainstream media, this is the worst group possible to represent it.
Maybe some of Sarkeesian's arguments are stretches, but she's right when she points out that women in video games by and large are written like ass. With maybe the exception of RPGs/JRPGs, where the fantasy elements easily allow for more gender parity.
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Post by Cyno on Aug 27, 2015 19:53:25 GMT -5
Also, after all the casual misogyny and entitlement issues, the single worst thing about Gamergate is that it, by default, puts me on the same "side" as drek like Kotaku and Polygon. That makes me throw up in my mouth a little.
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Jeff Mangum PI
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Post by Jeff Mangum PI on Aug 27, 2015 19:53:43 GMT -5
Wow, I can't believe it's been an entire year since I became completely embarrassed to call myself a gamer. I used to be so hardcore that MLG was my middle name and sometimes I bled Mountain Dew. Then Gamer Gate came along and I've been a filthy casual ever since. oi m8, fite me 1v1 on nuketown rite now, unless u cant handle sum banter
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 27, 2015 19:54:25 GMT -5
The mass media doesn't need to do any smear campaigning to make Gamergaters look bad when the average social media post using #gamergate does that well enough on its own. Unless you believe some dork from Gawker really has nothing else better to do than create hundreds of "false flag" Twitter accounts to smear whatever good name Gamergate members think it ever had. That's the problem when there's no organization or really any desire to actively weed out toxic elements from your "movement": they take over and it's a giant snowball effect. Well i cna agree with that,it becomes a mess and there is to some toxicity that it can become a big part of how people view it and they take part of the movement an so these people deserve what they are called for.But how big really is that toxic element? What if most of these people are simply ncie people that never flamed anyone because good number of people I meet online that say they are not against or support it are that. Of course i saw the assholes but that was in a much smaller part. But i cna agree that good number of then are entitled or see spook where there is nothing,which is big part why i could never call myself a "Gamergater" I also don`t think it is falseflag,i think it is simpyl picking all these bad people that joined and making it all about then,insteand of also showing the good people and good part of it,which i believe there is.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Aug 27, 2015 19:57:50 GMT -5
Slightly off-subject: Chun-Li's boobs aren't an especially heinous example of (the very real) misogyny in the industry, it's a design choice. There are far more egregious examples.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 27, 2015 19:59:11 GMT -5
Slightly off-subject: Chun-Li's boobs aren't an especially heinous example of (the very real) misogyny in the industry, it's a design choice. There are far more egregious examples. It wa sjust the first thing that popped out in my mind i`m sure you can say more which i might or might not agree.
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Post by Cyno on Aug 27, 2015 20:01:16 GMT -5
Slightly off-subject: Chun-Li's boobs aren't an especially heinous example of (the very real) misogyny in the industry, it's a design choice. There are far more egregious examples. I think of that dude from Ubisoft who tried to come up with all these hackneyed reasons why there wasn't a female Assassin skin in Unity's co-op. It was so strange, especially since Assassin's Creed actually had a decent track record for diversity. For a big AAA series, anyway.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 27, 2015 20:04:30 GMT -5
Slightly off-subject: Chun-Li's boobs aren't an especially heinous example of (the very real) misogyny in the industry, it's a design choice. There are far more egregious examples. I think of that dude from Ubisoft who tried to come up with all these hackneyed reasons why there wasn't a female Assassin skin in Unity's co-op. It was so strange, especially since Assassin's Creed actually had a decent track record for diversity. For a big AAA series, anyway. Yeh,that one was a case of big bullshit.They simply didn`t think female characters were worth the time and money,and that is ridiculous and sexist. That is a much better example
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Crimson
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Post by Crimson on Aug 27, 2015 20:12:19 GMT -5
Honestly, it was push back against the "SJW Boogeyman." That's what it continued to loop back to regardless of what the "Ethics in Gamer Journalism" guys continued to claim.
"Ethics In Gaming Journalism" really just meant "stop bringing up social inequalities in reviews."
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Push R Truth
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Post by Push R Truth on Aug 27, 2015 20:14:27 GMT -5
I think every time I sorta figure out what Gamergate even was, I see people talking about it and I get all confused again.
Is this one of those deals where I should just shake my head and walk away? Or am I doing myself a disservice by remaining confused?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2015 20:22:33 GMT -5
There's something I could link to that would explain GG in a nutshell, but I don't think I can post it as it can be seen as a one-sided argument against it. I'm gonna need a mod ruling before I can say anything else.
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wisdomwizard
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Post by wisdomwizard on Aug 27, 2015 20:29:44 GMT -5
The mass media doesn't need to do any smear campaigning to make Gamergaters look bad when the average social media post using #gamergate does that well enough on its own. Unless you believe some dork from Gawker really has nothing else better to do than create hundreds of "false flag" Twitter accounts to smear whatever good name Gamergate members think it ever had. That's the problem when there's no organization or really any desire to actively weed out toxic elements from your "movement": they take over and it's a giant snowball effect.
They haven't "taken over". Nobody I know of on Twitter said anything Gawker false-flagging but it HAS happened from idiot third-party trolls trying to instigate things between both sides. There hasn't been any evidence of Gamer Gate being directly responsible for harassment. In fact, a feminist site known as WAM actually studied and found that the harassment there was didn't have association with Gamer Gate.
Why is Gamer Gate responsible for what some trolls do, and why exactly do they have to police them? They already had a group of people who report any harassment they see towards GG or Anti-GG. It's really ultimately a hashtag. No other hashtag like #BlackLivesMatter are taken as much to task when people identify themselves with them while interrupting Presidential candidates so why does Gamer Game?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2015 20:34:11 GMT -5
I think every time I sorta figure out what Gamergate even was, I see people talking about it and I get all confused again. Is this one of those deals where I should just shake my head and walk away? Or am I doing myself a disservice by remaining confused? Shake & walk. It quickly became a "no one can agree on what they're all about" beyond the tagline "ethics in journalism" which even THAT was impossible to narrow in on because of the nonexistent structure of GG, that being anonymous, opaque, membership whose only requirement was to use the hashtag. When a "movement" has no real infrastructure or figurehead/representatives it becomes very clear that it's not a movement at all, just a lot of people yelling on hashtag with varying degrees of rationality. The opposing "movement" was equally ill-equipped from an organizational standpoint.
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wisdomwizard
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Post by wisdomwizard on Aug 27, 2015 20:39:19 GMT -5
It may not have official leaders but it hasn't needed them. They got a lot of sites not the least being Kotaku and Polygon to update their policies. They also got a lot of sponsors to pull away from Gawker.
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stealthamo
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Post by stealthamo on Aug 27, 2015 20:39:27 GMT -5
Eh, I've always seen it as two sides with differing goals. Pro-GG wants video game journalism to be not terrible, and Anti-GG wants more diversity in gaming. Both of which are commendable in their own rights. But the amount of shit slinging that seems to go on (that I've seen, I'm just a casual observer) from all sides (and trolls) has basically made the whole thing toxic.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2015 20:40:00 GMT -5
?? Gamers Gate is a video game download site. I bought UFO Aftermath and Afterlight off it.
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Post by Jacy Derangement Syndrome on Aug 27, 2015 20:46:29 GMT -5
I used to be so hardcore that MLG was my middle name and sometimes I bled Mountain Dew. Then Gamer Gate came along and I've been a filthy casual ever since. oi m8, fite me 1v1 on nuketown rite now, unless u cant handle sum banter b a n t e r c i t y b i t c h
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Aug 27, 2015 20:47:51 GMT -5
I think every time I sorta figure out what Gamergate even was, I see people talking about it and I get all confused again. Is this one of those deals where I should just shake my head and walk away? Or am I doing myself a disservice by remaining confused? Shake & walk. It quickly became a "no one can agree on what they're all about" beyond the tagline "ethics in journalism" which even THAT was impossible to narrow in on because of the nonexistent structure of GG, that being anonymous, opaque, membership whose only requirement was to use the hashtag. When a "movement" has no real infrastructure or figurehead/representatives it becomes very clear that it's not a movement at all, just a lot of people yelling on hashtag with varying degrees of rationality. The opposing "movement" was equally ill-equipped from an organizational standpoint. And most of its more vocal figureheads that have emerged look to me like they're in it to- and I won't go into details because of the rules, but I think it fits- gain political points than anything else. When a movement essentially originates from a game designer's ex-boyfriend basically sneak dissing (that's that shit I don't like) on her, it's unsurprising that its goals wind up being loosely defined.
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