Ben Wyatt
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I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Aug 22, 2019 7:13:00 GMT -5
Yeah, this is spot on. When you think about it, the only thing Charlotte hasn't done is win the Rumble. They've spent their wad on her already to the point where they kinda have no choice unless they decided to give her an extended blood feud away from the title....but they can't do *that* because nobody else has been built to resemble a credible threat to her. And i'm 99% sure she wins it this year. Unless againthere is a bigger overachieving storyline for the rumble. It sucks, because I think she's fantastic in the ring, and when they tone down her tribute act to her old man, she's fine character wise, but she's been crammed down everyone's throat to a level that'd make 2005-2007 Cena look like an afterthought to the point that I simply do not want to see her on my screen for a good long while
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 22, 2019 7:31:54 GMT -5
And i'm 99% sure she wins it this year. Unless againthere is a bigger overachieving storyline for the rumble. It sucks, because I think she's fantastic in the ring, and when they tone down her tribute act to her old man, she's fine character wise, but she's been crammed down everyone's throat to a level that'd make 2005-2007 Cena look like an afterthought to the point that I simply do not want to see her on my screen for a good long while Pretty much.I know she is amazing in the ring(but I will hardly disagree with complete package). But even then so much things outside of her,the 100 moments she gets,the women that are left in the dust when they feud with her,her character being AWFUL (I enjoyed when it looked like she was going Mad Queen but nope,back to "Not My Dad But Not Really" Flair)That I'm okay never watching Charlotte again, I had enough for a lifetime.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,529
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Aug 22, 2019 7:37:02 GMT -5
It sucks, because I think she's fantastic in the ring, and when they tone down her tribute act to her old man, she's fine character wise, but she's been crammed down everyone's throat to a level that'd make 2005-2007 Cena look like an afterthought to the point that I simply do not want to see her on my screen for a good long while Pretty much.I know she is amazing in the ring(but I will hardly disagree with complete package). But even then so much things outside of her,the 100 moments she gets,the women that are left in the dust when they feud with her,her character being AWFUL (I enjoyed when it looked like she was going Mad Queen but nope,back to "Not My Dad But Not Really" Flair)That I'm okay never watching Charlotte again, I had enough for a lifetime. Her "moments" would be far less grating if any of them felt in the slightest bit organic.
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fw91
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Post by fw91 on Aug 22, 2019 12:46:12 GMT -5
Yeah, this is spot on. When you think about it, the only thing Charlotte hasn't done is win the Rumble. They've spent their wad on her already to the point where they kinda have no choice unless they decided to give her an extended blood feud away from the title....but they can't do *that* because nobody else has been built to resemble a credible threat to her. And i'm 99% sure she wins it this year. Unless againthere is a bigger overachieving storyline for the rumble. I hate to say it, because it is very regressive, but I wouldn't mind if they scrapped the woman's rumble. Only 3 people can really win it (same could be said for mens) BUT the crowd doesn't recognize half the field and most of the eliminations are apron spots. Plus time/burn out is a huge factor. in 2018 two rumbles worked, but 2019 it didn't. IDK if that's because they had nostalgia that helped keep the crowd familiar or time for both rumbles was managed better.
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schma
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Post by schma on Aug 22, 2019 13:17:57 GMT -5
And i'm 99% sure she wins it this year. Unless againthere is a bigger overachieving storyline for the rumble. I hate to say it, because it is very regressive, but I wouldn't mind if they scrapped the woman's rumble. Only 3 people can really win it (same could be said for mens) BUT the crowd doesn't recognize half the field and most of the eliminations are apron spots. Plus time/burn out is a huge factor. in 2018 two rumbles worked, but 2019 it didn't. IDK if that's because they had nostalgia that helped keep the crowd familiar or time for both rumbles was managed better. I think part of the reason 2019 it didn't work was because there were several non rumble matches. Traditionally you only get a couple non-rumble matches but here they had 3 preshow matches and 5 regular matches on top of the two rumbles. That was way too many and the reason the men's rumble had to be rushed so much. A lot of those matches could have been moved to the next PPV.
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by fw91 on Aug 22, 2019 13:28:51 GMT -5
I hate to say it, because it is very regressive, but I wouldn't mind if they scrapped the woman's rumble. Only 3 people can really win it (same could be said for mens) BUT the crowd doesn't recognize half the field and most of the eliminations are apron spots. Plus time/burn out is a huge factor. in 2018 two rumbles worked, but 2019 it didn't. IDK if that's because they had nostalgia that helped keep the crowd familiar or time for both rumbles was managed better. I think part of the reason 2019 it didn't work was because there were several non rumble matches. Traditionally you only get a couple non-rumble matches but here they had 3 preshow matches and 5 regular matches on top of the two rumbles. That was way too many and the reason the men's rumble had to be rushed so much. A lot of those matches could have been moved to the next PPV. fair point. But the lack of familiarity the crowd have a chunk of the field is still a bit of a buzzkill. Maybe NxT on USA helps that?
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Aug 22, 2019 14:16:51 GMT -5
And i'm 99% sure she wins it this year. Unless againthere is a bigger overachieving storyline for the rumble. I hate to say it, because it is very regressive, but I wouldn't mind if they scrapped the woman's rumble. Only 3 people can really win it (same could be said for mens) BUT the crowd doesn't recognize half the field and most of the eliminations are apron spots. Plus time/burn out is a huge factor. in 2018 two rumbles worked, but 2019 it didn't. IDK if that's because they had nostalgia that helped keep the crowd familiar or time for both rumbles was managed better. Another big problem with doing a women's Rumble every year is the fact that the roster is a lot smaller then the men's and there's almost no turnover especially the last couple years with the big cut down on releases. They've also already had to dig into the legends and NXT bag to fill out the last two so I don't know how they can keep doing them while having the same people in it every year. Like is there anyone who could be in it for 2020 that they haven't used for one yet? Bianca Belair and Shayna Bayzler are the only two I can think of. Ronda would be another but I don't know if she's going to be healthy enough by that point.
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Post by theironyuppie on Aug 22, 2019 19:48:34 GMT -5
It sucks, because I think she's fantastic in the ring, and when they tone down her tribute act to her old man, she's fine character wise, but she's been crammed down everyone's throat to a level that'd make 2005-2007 Cena look like an afterthought to the point that I simply do not want to see her on my screen for a good long while Pretty much.I know she is amazing in the ring(but I will hardly disagree with complete package). But even then so much things outside of her,the 100 moments she gets,the women that are left in the dust when they feud with her,her character being AWFUL (I enjoyed when it looked like she was going Mad Queen but nope,back to "Not My Dad But Not Really" Flair)That I'm okay never watching Charlotte again, I had enough for a lifetime. At the same time, she spent eight months putting Becky over at every opportunity.
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Post by theironyuppie on Aug 22, 2019 19:51:14 GMT -5
It's kinda nutty that all three women's divisions are experiencing the same problems to a degree. Challengers are not being built up. Ember had a match and then Bayley was like hey here's a championship opportunity. Lacey waved a bunch and then spent five months feuding with Becky and constantly losing while the Raw Roster was MIA apart from Alexa and Nikki who were in a feud on Smackdown. The tag titles straight up disappeared after WM with established teams getting barely any screen time as a result. Charlotte right now is the default because she's always been presented as a contender and a champion. I knew as soon as she finished with Trish she'd be in the title scene. She's fantastic but for most of the past few years she has either had the title or been involved in a title program unless she was off tv. Summerslam broke the pattern but I knew that was just a short term blip and here we are. A lot of the answers to the issues of Charlotte's endless title opportunities, Becky's running roughshod over everyone and the other stuff is use the talents you have. The division is not large so why are 80% of them getting next to no screen time and zero time to build a character? Hell Becky could do a John Cena U.S. open type thing where every few weeks one of the women gets a chance at her. Have Becky struggle with some of them. Even that would do more to build up the roster than the absolute nothing they're doing right now. They were briefly doing this with Becky after Mania, then her match with Alicia Fox was poorly received and they stopped, besides her beating Bayley clean on SDL.
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Shark
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Post by Shark on Aug 24, 2019 0:05:35 GMT -5
It sucks, because I think she's fantastic in the ring, and when they tone down her tribute act to her old man, she's fine character wise, but she's been crammed down everyone's throat to a level that'd make 2005-2007 Cena look like an afterthought to the point that I simply do not want to see her on my screen for a good long while Pretty much.I know she is amazing in the ring(but I will hardly disagree with complete package). But even then so much things outside of her,the 100 moments she gets,the women that are left in the dust when they feud with her,her character being AWFUL ( I enjoyed when it looked like she was going Mad Queen but nope,back to "Not My Dad But Not Really" Flair)That I'm okay never watching Charlotte again, I had enough for a lifetime. Which is especially frustrating because that seemed like an interesting direction to take her character. Her losing a bit and going nuts because she wasn't the same anymore is an interesting way to go and they just waved at it as it passed them by.
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Post by madness50 on Aug 24, 2019 1:33:01 GMT -5
WWE need to sign Tessa Blanchard before AEW snag her. I agree 100 percent with that. I think WWE could have a helluva potential team up with Tessa and Charlotte. Could play up their fathers association with the original Horsemen. Eventually down the line, you could get one heck of a match between the two at a WrestleMania.
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Post by mistery on Aug 24, 2019 9:22:10 GMT -5
Pretty much.I know she is amazing in the ring(but I will hardly disagree with complete package). But even then so much things outside of her,the 100 moments she gets,the women that are left in the dust when they feud with her,her character being AWFUL ( I enjoyed when it looked like she was going Mad Queen but nope,back to "Not My Dad But Not Really" Flair)That I'm okay never watching Charlotte again, I had enough for a lifetime. Which is especially frustrating because that seemed like an interesting direction to take her character. Her losing a bit and going nuts because she wasn't the same anymore is an interesting way to go and they just waved at it as it passed them by. Honestly while they could still go that route eventually, I don't think they will. Simply because it doesn't tie into them being able to constantly tell everyone that Charlotte is the daughter of Ric Flair (something they shove down our throats every single time she's even mentioned), and that Io Shirai is doing the mad queen gimmick a lot better than Charlotte ever will.
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Post by Mr PONYMANIA Mr Jenzie on Aug 24, 2019 10:12:55 GMT -5
but this isn't the happy-go-lucky bailey ..... this is the happy-go-lucky bailey that SHOVES YOU OFF YOUR SEAT!!! good grief i mean charlotte almost broke that vase on the way down i watched it a few times too
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schma
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Post by schma on Aug 24, 2019 13:02:00 GMT -5
Which is especially frustrating because that seemed like an interesting direction to take her character. Her losing a bit and going nuts because she wasn't the same anymore is an interesting way to go and they just waved at it as it passed them by. Honestly while they could still go that route eventually, I don't think they will. Simply because it doesn't tie into them being able to constantly tell everyone that Charlotte is the daughter of Ric Flair (something they shove down our throats every single time she's even mentioned), and that Io Shirai is doing the mad queen gimmick a lot better than Charlotte ever will. I've been banging the drum for a while that they need to shed all the Charlotte Flair cosplays as her dad. She's come far enough that she can stand on her own without constant references to her father. I think it would do a lot to win more fans over too. We rag on Nattie for always mentioning her uncle but even she's never gone full cosplay like Flair has.
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Post by Hypnosis on Aug 24, 2019 19:46:26 GMT -5
Honestly while they could still go that route eventually, I don't think they will. Simply because it doesn't tie into them being able to constantly tell everyone that Charlotte is the daughter of Ric Flair (something they shove down our throats every single time she's even mentioned), and that Io Shirai is doing the mad queen gimmick a lot better than Charlotte ever will. I've been banging the drum for a while that they need to shed all the Charlotte Flair cosplays as her dad. She's come far enough that she can stand on her own without constant references to her father. I think it would do a lot to win more fans over too. We rag on Nattie for always mentioning her uncle but even she's never gone full cosplay like Flair has.Well, Natalya's theme is similar to Bret's, anyway.
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schma
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Post by schma on Aug 24, 2019 20:00:58 GMT -5
I've been banging the drum for a while that they need to shed all the Charlotte Flair cosplays as her dad. She's come far enough that she can stand on her own without constant references to her father. I think it would do a lot to win more fans over too. We rag on Nattie for always mentioning her uncle but even she's never gone full cosplay like Flair has.Well, Natalya's theme is similar to Bret's, anyway. Yeah, she's definitely got some cosplay elements. She had the Hart Foundation jacket for a while and the sharpshooter, often does pink and black gear. It just never quite reached the level of Flair.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 24, 2019 20:01:46 GMT -5
I've been banging the drum for a while that they need to shed all the Charlotte Flair cosplays as her dad. She's come far enough that she can stand on her own without constant references to her father. I think it would do a lot to win more fans over too. We rag on Nattie for always mentioning her uncle but even she's never gone full cosplay like Flair has.Well, Natalya's theme is similar to Bret's, anyway. Isn`t Charlotte`s theme just a generic rock cover of Ric Flair`s theme? Even there Natalya lays less thick.
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schma
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Post by schma on Aug 24, 2019 20:26:56 GMT -5
Well, Natalya's theme is similar to Bret's, anyway. Isn`t Charlotte`s theme just a generic rock cover of Ric Flair`s theme? Even there Natalya lays less thick. Yeah I laid it out in another thread but with Charlotte her robes are a remix of dad's, her music is a remix of dad's, her finisher is a remix of dad's, she straight up copped the woos and strut. There's probably more I'm forgetting right now. About the only thing she doesn't borrow from Ric is her ability to complete top rope moves.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Aug 24, 2019 20:40:27 GMT -5
Isn`t Charlotte`s theme just a generic rock cover of Ric Flair`s theme? Even there Natalya lays less thick. Yeah I laid it out in another thread but with Charlotte her robes are a remix of dad's, her music is a remix of dad's, her finisher is a remix of dad's, she straight up copped the woos and strut. There's probably more I'm forgetting right now. About the only thing she doesn't borrow from Ric is her ability to complete top rope moves. Well, considering her moonsault maybe Ric Flair not being able to complete was for the best
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Post by grungesmurf on Aug 25, 2019 11:05:53 GMT -5
Isn`t Charlotte`s theme just a generic rock cover of Ric Flair`s theme? Even there Natalya lays less thick. Yeah I laid it out in another thread but with Charlotte her robes are a remix of dad's, her music is a remix of dad's, her finisher is a remix of dad's, she straight up copped the woos and strut. There's probably more I'm forgetting right now. About the only thing she doesn't borrow from Ric is her ability to complete top rope moves. She’s blonde😎
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