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Post by mrpeacock on Sept 21, 2023 7:17:18 GMT -5
Moxley sells so well I think folks just assumed he was just acting punch drunk out there. And he largely made the match work. Obviously Knox should have just counted him out but these things aren't always super easy to spot in the moment. Hindsight is 20/20. Most refs are trained to count 3 regardless if it’s the finish or not. If you don’t kick out then the match is done. He should’ve done what he was trained to do.
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Kalmia
King Koopa
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Post by Kalmia on Sept 21, 2023 7:33:16 GMT -5
Moxley sells so well I think folks just assumed he was just acting punch drunk out there. And he largely made the match work. Obviously Knox should have just counted him out but these things aren't always super easy to spot in the moment. Hindsight is 20/20. Most refs are trained to count 3 regardless if it’s the finish or not. If you don’t kick out then the match is done. He should’ve done what he was trained to do. That's what the refs in WWE are told to do. I don't know if the AEW refs are told the same though, I don't think that's ever been reported. There was another incident recently where it seemed someone didn't kick out (anyone remember that?) so the instructions might be different in AEW.
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Post by mrpeacock on Sept 21, 2023 7:39:45 GMT -5
Most refs are trained to count 3 regardless if it’s the finish or not. If you don’t kick out then the match is done. He should’ve done what he was trained to do. That's what the refs in WWE are told to do. I don't know if the AEW refs are told the same though, I don't think that's ever been reported. There was another incident recently where it seemed someone didn't kick out (anyone remember that?) so the instructions might be different in AEW. I don’t see what a downside would be to train them to count 3 unless they kick out. If they don’t kick out then the match is over.
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Post by Celexa Bliss 54 on Sept 21, 2023 7:49:24 GMT -5
Rey Fenix absolutely deserves a run here, but I don't trust Tony not to downgrade the title now Fenix is very much on the same level as OC and Mox. If anything, having the title will hopefully cement him as a star in other people's eyes.
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Post by mrpeacock on Sept 21, 2023 7:55:49 GMT -5
This kind of exposes the downside of giving title matches to people who in Kayfabe don’t deserve them. Fenix only has singles wins over lower level talent, not saying he’s not good enough to be champion. He just wasn’t built up enough to be getting a shot yet.
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Post by Ryushinku on Sept 21, 2023 8:00:04 GMT -5
Question is whether they make him drop it back quick, or decide to try doing something with an unexpected title run.
Still, mostly just relieved the news wasn't worse for Mox.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Sept 21, 2023 8:06:43 GMT -5
That's what the refs in WWE are told to do. I don't know if the AEW refs are told the same though, I don't think that's ever been reported. There was another incident recently where it seemed someone didn't kick out (anyone remember that?) so the instructions might be different in AEW. I don’t see what a downside would be to train them to count 3 unless they kick out. If they don’t kick out then the match is over. That has been the general trend in WWE but it has gone back and forth over time because Vince would get upset when a ref doesn't count when a guy forgot to kick out but then would get upset when the ref counted a pin he wasn't supposed to when the guy didn't kick out since that would screw up his finish.
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Sept 21, 2023 8:08:55 GMT -5
I'm just glad Mox is going to be OK. The way in which Rey was kind of celebrating over Mox because he didn't know to do, and how long it took Mox to get up was genuinely one of the more frightening things I've seen in person. Just a reminder of the type of shit these guys put themselves through for our entertainment.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Sept 21, 2023 8:34:43 GMT -5
Rey Fenix absolutely deserves a run here, but I don't trust Tony not to downgrade the title now Fenix is very much on the same level as OC and Mox. If anything, having the title will hopefully cement him as a star in other people's eyes. Honestly Fenix and Penta are at a level where one of them needed a singles title to make them that duel tag/singles threat.
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Post by Cyno on Sept 21, 2023 8:46:55 GMT -5
This kind of exposes the downside of giving title matches to people who in Kayfabe don’t deserve them. Fenix only has singles wins over lower level talent, not saying he’s not good enough to be champion. He just wasn’t built up enough to be getting a shot yet. Fenix is a former tag and trios champ and a guy who's been in the company since Day 1. He's a solid choice for a midcard champion. This was also built to be Fenix's chance to get revenge against Mox for "injuring" him before the Stadium Stampede at All In.
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KME
Team Rocket
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Post by KME on Sept 21, 2023 8:50:37 GMT -5
While Rey isn't necessarily pushed hard whenever he wrestles singles I think you get away with it based on the strength of who he is. If Nick Jackson won the TNT Title a bit out of the blue I don't think it'd be an issue either for example. If Action Andretti was in this position in Mox's first defence, yeah that'd be a problem, but Rey not quite so much, and he did take Mox to the brink just before All In so that lends him a bit of believability.
They've got an interesting opportunity now to get him over as a singles guy because he's already popular, has a great look and is one of the most impressive high fliers ever, hoping he gets a decent run rather than dropping it straight away.
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Kalmia
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Post by Kalmia on Sept 21, 2023 8:52:45 GMT -5
That's what the refs in WWE are told to do. I don't know if the AEW refs are told the same though, I don't think that's ever been reported. There was another incident recently where it seemed someone didn't kick out (anyone remember that?) so the instructions might be different in AEW. I don’t see what a downside would be to train them to count 3 unless they kick out. If they don’t kick out then the match is over. I agree that's how it should be done. I was just pointing out that it might not currently be the AEW rule.
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mrbananagrabber
King Koopa
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Post by mrbananagrabber on Sept 21, 2023 9:13:05 GMT -5
Man, that’s got to feel like a bittersweet moment for Fenix; yaaay, you won a title - that you weren’t supposed to win, like, at all.
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Post by mrpeacock on Sept 21, 2023 9:16:22 GMT -5
This kind of exposes the downside of giving title matches to people who in Kayfabe don’t deserve them. Fenix only has singles wins over lower level talent, not saying he’s not good enough to be champion. He just wasn’t built up enough to be getting a shot yet. Fenix is a former tag and trios champ and a guy who's been in the company since Day 1. He's a solid choice for a midcard champion. This was also built to be Fenix's chance to get revenge against Mox for "injuring" him before the Stadium Stampede at All In. We can agree to disagree on what establishes someone for a singles title in the context of a story. But to me a guy that hasn’t picked up a major singles victory in AEW shouldn’t be challenging for ANY singles belts.
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Post by Dave the Dave on Sept 21, 2023 9:17:18 GMT -5
It sucks that it happened, but it kind of fixes a problem I have with BCC being so dominant. This match was for revenge. Fenix was gonna lose and for sure wasn’t gonna ever beat Moxley on purpose. So now, Claudio and Moxley actually got beaten and some payback for their heelish ways.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Sept 21, 2023 9:21:02 GMT -5
He's right about Knox.
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Post by Cyno on Sept 21, 2023 9:22:38 GMT -5
Fenix is a former tag and trios champ and a guy who's been in the company since Day 1. He's a solid choice for a midcard champion. This was also built to be Fenix's chance to get revenge against Mox for "injuring" him before the Stadium Stampede at All In. We can agree to disagree on what establishes someone for a singles title in the context of a story. But to me a guy that hasn’t picked up a major singles victory in AEW shouldn’t be challenging for ANY singles belts. Moxley is also a guy who takes on all comers and carried on Orange's open challenge stance. So it still makes sense from that standpoint even without the revenge hook. Fenix actually winning was obviously not the intended result, but I think the "open challenge" rule backfiring in such an unexpected way is a good way to make lemonade from the lemon of Mox's concussion. Let Fenix have a couple of solid title defenses in the meantime to more firmly establish him as a solid singles wrestler in addition to his proven track record as a tag team wrestler.
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jb80
AC Slater
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Post by jb80 on Sept 21, 2023 9:26:50 GMT -5
Rick Knox is dedicated to his craft. Bad ref in kayfabe and reality.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Sept 21, 2023 9:39:11 GMT -5
I f***ing hate the phrase "minor concussion". It's a goddamned brain injury that shut him down, even if briefly. On a scale of 1-5 maybe it's a two but even an 2 of anything disaster can cause future problems. And I know this isn't a Meltzer thing, it's general parlance, but if you want this stuff taken seriously that has got to change.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Sept 21, 2023 9:45:22 GMT -5
Rick Knox is dedicated to his craft. Bad ref in kayfabe and reality. He really is. This a big botch. Doubt they reprimand or fine him, but I wouldn’t bat an eye if they did. Glad Mox is seemingly ok.
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