Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2012 22:38:45 GMT -5
Cena's promo on Punk was one of the best promos Cena's ever cut. Even better is the fact that you knew most of that came from Cena's heart. He meant what he said and that's what made it powerful. He needs to stay with more serious heartfelt promos and stay away from kiddy ones and it would work out best for him.
After all that was said I truly do think Punk will lose the belt at Night of Champions. Besides Punk heeling it out, besides the fact that Cena's comments were the truth, besides the fact they've been constantly talking about how long he's held the belt and besides the fact that Cena's face is on the cover of Night of Champions practically saying "It's good to be home" we have this tonight. Until the ppv they're going to really be doing whatever it takes to make Punk as much of a heel asshole as possible so that when he loses it'll be deserved.
It is what it is. Cena told the truth. It worked well. All is good.
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Post by BorneAgain on Aug 20, 2012 22:38:45 GMT -5
I think that's why he's the only who could have made that speech because he has been in the position of not getting deserved regard when he's done so much. The Career of John Cena: A Legend in Obscurity. Guys like Christian got it easy. Cena knows all about hard knocks and doing it for DIS BIDNESS and getting nothing in return. In terms of kayfabe though, its not exactly been fantastic for a guy who compared to Austin, Rock, and even Hogan has been a model champion and person to constantly be booed and told he can't wrestle because he's perceived as uncool. By sheer comparison Punk is a champion who isn't wrestling in the last match on PPVs, Cena is a guy who gets hate and vitriol for merely existing. In that sense that the latter can deal with it with dignity and a smile while the former gets in people's faces and complains does say something. |
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Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
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Post by Krimzon on Aug 20, 2012 22:39:29 GMT -5
Holy shit it's like Hogan & Savage all over again. I hated it then and I hate it now.
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Post by Snaptastic on Aug 20, 2012 22:40:18 GMT -5
Punk was the underdog then. Now, no matter where hes at on the card, he's dominant. Him coming out and saying what he's saying would be like Sheamus coming out and calling himself an underdog. It just doesnt make that much sense, and comes off as the rich wanting to be richer, rather than the oppressed rising up to take what they feel belongs to them. Punk is no longer the underdog, hes a dynasty! He has become the New York Yankees St Louis Cardinals. At least thats my view on why he isnt getting as much backing now as he was before. Punk is still the underdog when it comes to the likes of Cena, HHH, & Lesnar. Not as much as he'd have you believe. But we can't compare him to the likes of HHH & Lesnar as they're rarities now. Besides Rock put him over at RAW 1000 both verbally and physically. Rock is considered bigger than both HHH & Lesnar. In my book he's top 3 and Punk has been put shoulder to shoulder with him. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2012 22:40:48 GMT -5
But at no point did anybody call what Cena was doing worthless. That's what Cena did tonight. He completely buried Punk's reign as champion, making the past 9 months seem like they didn't matter. When did he call it worthless? "You've been the WWE champion for 9 months, and you are firmly in the backseat." No "but...", just full stop. and then "the only thing any one remembers about your reign is when you blew a kiss to Vince McMahon and left with the WWE championship." Meaning that no one remembers any of this 9 month title reign he's had. And the mark-ish fans will hear Cena say that and think that now. He buried his reign, big time. It's just sad because Punk's done everything he can and got over as hell, never got positioned where he should've been as the top champ in the business, and is now being emasculated on screen at every turn for it while turning into a one dimensional whiner charcter-wise. It's a total hatchet job unless this is leading to something else, but I can't see that happening. |
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Post by Hanz Moleman on Aug 20, 2012 22:41:05 GMT -5
Most of the board also thought HHH was going over Lesnar. Okay, here's a deal: If CM Punk beats John Cena clean at Night of Champions, I will cease posting on this forum forever. Well I don't think any of us want that  But think about this for a second, Who is on Cena's level as far as they have billed him? Undertaker? Triple H? Rock and Brock definitely. Cena is the Hogan of this era, there is no doubt in that, but perhaps he is willing to elevate Punk to the next level in EVERYBODIES eyes. I'm not a hardcore IWC member, I take what I watch for what it is, and if it interest me like this feud is doing, then WWE is doing their job right. They have thrown enough curveballs in the past year. |
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Aug 20, 2012 22:41:24 GMT -5
Holy s*** it's like Hogan & Savage all over again. I hated it then and I hate it now. Good comparison actually. And though as a little Hulkamaniac, I was cheering Hogan; I can look back and see.. Randy was right. Punk is too. |
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Post by Snaptastic on Aug 20, 2012 22:42:09 GMT -5
To bring RL into it a second. Weren't Punk's segments tanking in the ratings for a long while? And that is entirely the fault of the bookers and producers. Wait that's not fair. If we can attribute ratings success to Punk when they happen, he surely has to take the blame when his segments tank in the ratings. |
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metylerca
King Koopa
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Post by metylerca on Aug 20, 2012 22:43:55 GMT -5
That's something that almost everybody has to go through. Punk busted his ass for 9 months? Cena busted his ass for two years after entering the main event before becoming the undisputed top guy. Before 2007, HHH, HBK, Batista, Undertaker, and Hogan were all more important than him. And yet he never bitched and whined about lacking respect. But at no point did anybody call what Cena was doing worthless. That's what Cena did tonight. He completely buried Punk's reign as champion, making the past 9 months seem like they didn't matter. I want to meet the fans out there who hear this promo and go "Gee whiz, Cena said Punk's reign was worthless. Clearly it's true, and all those times I cheered him on, they were worthless too. What a promo, Cena!" |
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Post by Richard on Aug 20, 2012 22:44:48 GMT -5
Cena's half was good but I still don't get how Punk saying and doing what made him face a little over a year ago is now somehow making him a heel and it seems 3/4 the audience feels the same. Punk was the underdog then. Now, no matter where hes at on the card, he's dominant. Him coming out and saying what he's saying would be like Sheamus coming out and calling himself an underdog. It just doesnt make that much sense, and comes off as the rich wanting to be richer, rather than the oppressed rising up to take what they feel belongs to them. Punk is no longer the underdog, hes a dynasty! He has become the New York Yankees St Louis Cardinals. At least thats my view on why he isnt getting as much backing now as he was before. Is he really? Seems more like the...damn I suck at MLB....some team that won but people think it's a fluke to be honest. Everyone knows he's good but no one important thinks he's ready for the show. |
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mcd
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Post by mcd on Aug 20, 2012 22:47:25 GMT -5
I like to think I know what they are going for with both Cena and Punk's arguements tonight. The problem seems to lie in a few things but two stand out.
Cena's promo was great. Really expressed Cena's frustrations with what he views as a champion putting HIMSELF on the backburner then complaining about it. Like he respects Punk for working hard and keeping the title so long, but wonders why Punk feels the need to hear others tell him.
HOWEVER...John Cena has a very dismissive tone to alot of his more serious promos and I think it's just the cadence of his speech, but it WRECKS any semblance of his talk being anything other than "I would like a title shot, Nyyyah"
Punk played, and plays, edgy champ very well. He works his butt off, probably IS a little miffed that he isn't seen as bigger than he is and it makes what he says come across very heartfelt and true. I believe Punk's major issue is an inability to put forth effort in things he does not believe, or angles that make NO sense.
While justified, others have the ability to give even the WORSE storylines more believablity. All I get from Punk at the moment is that he would really rather not do what this angle is asking of him, not that I blame him as I see him, Cena, Bryan and a few others as insightful enough to see where the future lies for them after a story is laid out.
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Post by Some Guy on Aug 20, 2012 22:47:26 GMT -5
This isn't Punk's first reign, he was a champ in 2008 and 2009 and 2011 before this reign. This is supposed to be his star making reign, but instead he's taking a backseat to Cena. Cena STILL main evented multiple PPVs in his first reign of all things, and then main evented EVERY PPV once he got it back from Edge. Punk hasn't gotten a chance to main event one, ONE, this entire year through EIGHT PPVs. It's a load of s***, and I'm totally on Punk's side here. Cena main evented 3 pay-per-views during his first reign, and one of those was more about Shawn vs. Angle than it was him. Ever since Money in the Bank 2011, Punk main evented 5, one without the title involved. And by the time Cena got the belt back from Edge in LATE 2006, he'd already proved himself as the top guy, after playing second-fiddle to DX, Hogan, 'Taker, and Batista ever since winning the title at WrestleMania 21. The only time he took a backseat to D-X at a PPV was when he wasn't even the champ, as he lost it to RVD and then Edge won it back on a Raw. And again, this was Cena's reign, when the two titles were about equal with each other. Now, they are completely far apart and individual guys without titles are treated as bigger than the title. Cena never went EIGHT PPVs without headlining, especially on his fifth title reign in general. |
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Aug 20, 2012 22:47:29 GMT -5
By that same token though you can say for the past year that Cena HAS been the top face by providence, getting main events when he's not been champion just because he's John Cena. Punk's right there. His character may be whiny about it, but he's not wrong. Well of course Cena's going to get a healthy chunk of hype despite (the impatient) Punk being champion, he's a more established act. Again, going back to Cena's first couple of long reigns, he rarely ever closed out shows. It took him roughly a year and a half to become "top dog" after his WM21 win. Punk, in this instance, is like Oprah Winfrey throwing a temper tantrum and trying to paint herself as Oliver Twist because Forbes pays more lipservice towards Bill Gates as opposed to her. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2012 22:47:44 GMT -5
But at no point did anybody call what Cena was doing worthless. That's what Cena did tonight. He completely buried Punk's reign as champion, making the past 9 months seem like they didn't matter. I want to meet the fans out there who hear this promo and go "Gee whiz, Cena said Punk's reign was worthless. Clearly it's true, and all those times I cheered him on, they were worthless too. What a promo, Cena!" Man, these fans do exist. Back in December fans at the bar I watch PPVs at were saying "CM Punk sux he couldn't beat Triple H or Randy Orton". I tried explaining "well yeah, but that was pre-determined, Punk's just really great at wrestling" and got "but he can't beat Randy Orton" in return. There's a lot more marky fans than some people realize. To those kids who liked Punk and cheering him on, and Cena was still their top dude, they totally ate up what he said tonight. |
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Post by Hanz Moleman on Aug 20, 2012 22:47:55 GMT -5
And that is entirely the fault of the bookers and producers. Wait that's not fair. If we can attribute ratings success to Punk when they happen, he surely has to take the blame when his segments tank in the ratings. Exactly. But at the same token I think we should acknowledge that ratings don't really mean squat these days unless you are tanking. Wrestling hasn't been the "it" thing for years, it has its dedicated audience and will occasionally bring in the new viewer. Its not going anywhere. Especially in the age of streams and DVR. |
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Sc
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Post by Sc on Aug 20, 2012 22:48:01 GMT -5
Most of the board also thought HHH was going over Lesnar. And it seemed a majority saw Cena going over Rock What the hell is wrong with this board? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2012 22:48:27 GMT -5
Okay, here's a deal: If CM Punk beats John Cena clean at Night of Champions, I will cease posting on this forum forever. Well I don't think any of us want that The reason why I say it (and I'll do it if it happens) is because I am 99 percent sure that Cena will beat Punk. This is just classic WWE deconstructing a character once they turn heel. In fact, they've already done this with Punk before. |
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mrjl
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Post by mrjl on Aug 20, 2012 22:48:50 GMT -5
Cena's half was good but I still don't get how Punk saying and doing what made him face a little over a year ago is now somehow making him a heel and it seems 3/4 the audience feels the same. cause he wasn't really a face a year ago. |
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Aug 20, 2012 22:49:36 GMT -5
Holy s*** it's like Hogan & Savage all over again. I hated it then and I hate it now. Good comparison actually. And though as a little Hulkamaniac, I was cheering Hogan; I can look back and see.. Randy was right. Punk is too. Savage was nothing more than a paranoid lunatic. As is Punk. |
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Post by Hanz Moleman on Aug 20, 2012 22:50:41 GMT -5
And it seemed a majority saw Cena going over Rock What the hell is wrong with this board? Its the IWC and everyone thinks they can predict whats gonna happen next? |
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