mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
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Post by mizerable on Nov 6, 2015 11:47:11 GMT -5
He dismissed the loss, but clearly it *did* effect him. He might not have broken down and wept, but his body clearly told the story that Lesnar did some damage to him. And there is no way you're going to pin Axel's atrocious booking all on the shoulders of HHH's character. That's not the point I was making. The fact of the matter is that he treated the match as a joke, essentially saying that after he had beaten Brock, Brock needed Heyman to assist him otherwise he may have lost to Triple H again. Had Triple H won the match, the narrative of him having a concussion doesn't change things. He dismissed the loss claiming it wasn't a real loss. And Axel did suck but Triple H didn't help matters by having him fluke a victory his way out of the gate. That's setting him up for failure.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 6, 2015 12:01:22 GMT -5
He dismissed the loss, but clearly it *did* effect him. He might not have broken down and wept, but his body clearly told the story that Lesnar did some damage to him. And there is no way you're going to pin Axel's atrocious booking all on the shoulders of HHH's character. That's not the point I was making. The fact of the matter is that he treated the match as a joke, essentially saying that after he had beaten Brock, Brock needed Heyman to assist him otherwise he may have lost to Triple H again. Had Triple H won the match, the narrative of him having a concussion doesn't change things. He dismissed the loss claiming it wasn't a real loss. And Axel did suck but Triple H didn't help matters by having him fluke a victory his way out of the gate. That's setting him up for failure. I'm just not sure what HHH was supposed to say. "Brock kicked my ass. He completely dominated me, and it's clear I suck"? Austin,Rock, Hogan,Flair, Savage....etc. Guys of that ilk would have almost always done the same thing.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,802
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 6, 2015 12:11:25 GMT -5
Remember that promo where HHH said that he and Taker were the last of a dying breed and basically made it seem like everyone in the locker room was a joke compared to them? I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other.
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Woo
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Woo on Nov 6, 2015 12:16:04 GMT -5
If Dave came out an hour from now and reported that HHH has decided that Extreme Rules would take place in Auschwitz and be main evented by Scotty Goldman vs Unfrozen Nazi soldier Heidenreich, 85% of you guys would accept it without question because HHH is appearanly a huge douche and the biggest egomaniac ever...or something. You'll find that 3 decades of reliable news will make people trust you.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 12:21:26 GMT -5
Remember that promo where HHH said that he and Taker were the last of a dying breed and basically made it seem like everyone in the locker room was a joke compared to them? I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other. Eh, I think there was a way to state it without basically making it seem like everyone else is beneath them. He could have played it like they're the two old lions in the pride who want to prove they can still go because the competition is so fierce backstage right now so they're gonna prove they can tear the house down. HHH in the ivory tower, Undertaker in the shadows. There's a bunch of ways they could of played it to make it compelling without basically going, "Everyone else is beneath us." And here they are three years later, scrambling to get Cena and Lesnar back on RAW earlier than scheduled because they haven't built any new stars.
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Post by RedSmile on Nov 6, 2015 12:24:22 GMT -5
If Dave came out an hour from now and reported that HHH has decided that Extreme Rules would take place in Auschwitz and be main evented by Scotty Goldman vs Unfrozen Nazi soldier Heidenreich, 85% of you guys would accept it without question because HHH is appearanly a huge douche and the biggest egomaniac ever...or something. You really think people would believe that HHH would hire one of CM Punk's best friends?
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Woo
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Woo on Nov 6, 2015 12:24:35 GMT -5
I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other. Eh, I think there was a way to state it without basically making it seem like everyone else is beneath them. He could have played it like they're the two old lions in the pride who want to prove they can still go because the competition is so fierce backstage right now so they're gonna prove they can tear the house down. HHH in the ivory tower, Undertaker in the shadows. There's a bunch of ways they could of played it to make it compelling without basically going, "Everyone else is beneath us." And here they are three years later, scrambling to get Cena and Lesnar back on RAW earlier than scheduled because they haven't built any new stars. I was more annoyed by the End of an Era match not ending the era. Both men were back the very next year and still haven't left.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 12:25:42 GMT -5
Didn't that final HHH/Lesnar match, had Lesnar begging HHH and saying stuff like "Please paul stop" during the match? Because to me, that didn't make brock look strong at all. Sure he beat him at the end, but man he looked weak during the match and needed Heyman's help to win. Totally the opposite of the booking in WM XXX, SS 14', and WM31 where Lesnar looked like a total beast that doesn't fear anyone. Yep. Triple H came out the night after on Raw and pretty much no sold the loss because Brock needed Heyman to beat him, after Triple H proved he could hang with him because he's the asskicker and he now wears black wrist tape. He used this as a means to essentially tell the audience that he (Triple H) was the actual winner of the feud because of this. He's done this many times before where he practically rolls his eyes about losing because it's not a big deal since he's already proven himself. I should also mention that this feud had so little heat, that they resorted to needing a promo of Stephanie McMahon defending her children after Heyman briefly mentioned them in one of his promos...that's how desperate they were to get people on Trips' side. Gee..you know...if you could f***ing sell a loss every once in a while...MAYBE the audience would have a little bit of compassion for you. I still maintain that not many people wanted to see this match. Yet they stretched it out for a year when Brock could instead be shown to dominate guys like Orton and Del Rio. It was hilarious how Paul saying "you teach your kids to talk that way Steph?", after she made fun of his weight, turned into Shawn Michaels saying "Brock attacked Triple H's children". Then Shawn had to get beat up to get Lesnar heat, because Triple H has no sympathy and wouldn't look that weak anyway.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 12:30:10 GMT -5
Eh, I think there was a way to state it without basically making it seem like everyone else is beneath them. He could have played it like they're the two old lions in the pride who want to prove they can still go because the competition is so fierce backstage right now so they're gonna prove they can tear the house down. HHH in the ivory tower, Undertaker in the shadows. There's a bunch of ways they could of played it to make it compelling without basically going, "Everyone else is beneath us." And here they are three years later, scrambling to get Cena and Lesnar back on RAW earlier than scheduled because they haven't built any new stars. I was more annoyed by the End of an Era match not ending the era. Both men were back the very next year and still haven't left. It really did feel like the "Death of Superman" of wrestling storylines.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 12:30:00 GMT -5
Remember that promo where HHH said that he and Taker were the last of a dying breed and basically made it seem like everyone in the locker room was a joke compared to them? I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other. He talked about how people from their era went out and laid it on the line, and fought like men...implying the current generation doesn't do that. This was the same year as the "broomstick" promo (and he was a face when he said that!), so yeah, not like he's above burying the whole roster.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Nov 6, 2015 12:34:38 GMT -5
I'm just not sure what HHH was supposed to say. "Brock kicked my ass. He completely dominated me, and it's clear I suck"? Austin,Rock, Hogan,Flair, Savage....etc. Guys of that ilk would have almost always done the same thing. I think every wrestler you mentioned would've handled it much better. But in terms of what he could say? Here's a very basic formula that would've worked and done the same thing. Triple H calls out Brock, saying this isn't over. Heyman comes out saying that Brock isn't here but here's my new Heyman guy; Curtis Axel. The focus shifts from Lesnar to Axel. There ya go. You get to where you need to go without f***ing burying anyone for no goddamn reason. Wrestling isn't THAT hard to write.
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Fauxnaki
Unicron
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Post by Fauxnaki on Nov 6, 2015 12:38:17 GMT -5
I refuse to believe this is real
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Nov 6, 2015 12:42:30 GMT -5
I don't know about all this newz but I do know HHH can EAD.
...Flat out, I just don't like dude, haha.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Nov 6, 2015 12:45:06 GMT -5
I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other. Sounds like a great time to retire then, if they've done everything.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,802
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 6, 2015 12:53:26 GMT -5
I don't think that comment was nearly as terrible as people made it out to be. He and Taker had done everything there is to do in the business from a kayfabe standpoint and pretty much beat everyone there is to beat. Their last great challenge was each other. Eh, I think there was a way to state it without basically making it seem like everyone else is beneath them. He could have played it like they're the two old lions in the pride who want to prove they can still go because the competition is so fierce backstage right now so they're gonna prove they can tear the house down. HHH in the ivory tower, Undertaker in the shadows. There's a bunch of ways they could of played it to make it compelling without basically going, "Everyone else is beneath us." And here they are three years later, scrambling to get Cena and Lesnar back on RAW earlier than scheduled because they haven't built any new stars. I looked at that promo/build as them being like members of each generation as it gets older "our generation is the greatest ever". And honestly outside of Cena, most of the locker room guys *are* beneath them from an accomplishment standpoint
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2015 12:58:33 GMT -5
Eh, I think there was a way to state it without basically making it seem like everyone else is beneath them. He could have played it like they're the two old lions in the pride who want to prove they can still go because the competition is so fierce backstage right now so they're gonna prove they can tear the house down. HHH in the ivory tower, Undertaker in the shadows. There's a bunch of ways they could of played it to make it compelling without basically going, "Everyone else is beneath us." And here they are three years later, scrambling to get Cena and Lesnar back on RAW earlier than scheduled because they haven't built any new stars. I looked at that promo/build as them being like members of each generation as it gets older "our generation is the greatest ever". And honestly outside of Cena, most of the locker room guys *are* beneath them from an accomplishment standpoint I'll definitely agree that the promos built the match up to make it seem more epic than it actually was, but its like throwing the horses under the cart to make it seem taller. Works for about a day, then you've just got a pile of rotten horsemeat and no way to move forward.
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Post by Mid-Carder on Nov 6, 2015 13:05:29 GMT -5
Remember that promo where HHH said that he and Taker were the last of a dying breed and basically made it seem like everyone in the locker room was a joke compared to them? I fully believe that HHH, the person, not the character really does believe that. So it wouldn't surprise me in the least if he saw himself on the same level as SCSA, the Rock, etc to the point that he sees the declining ratings and starts to think to himself, "I gotta come outta retirement to help SAVE this company. I don't wanna do it, but...." though he probably would really love it. My friend and I still joke to this day about a WWE magazine picture of Triple H and Austin that was captioned "Attitude Era co-pioneers". I think they really believe that, too. We still call him "co-pioneer".
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by The Ichi on Nov 6, 2015 13:06:22 GMT -5
The best thing about these threads is that one poster that will dig through the 2 or 3 out of a million instances where HHH might have done the right thing.
He's got an ego problem, it's clear as day watching his career and even clearer reading reports (not just from newz, from co-workers, documentaries etc). At what point do you stop and admit it? You don't even have to stop being a fan of him, but just admit it, lol.
And that's not even getting into this rumor as it appears to have been debunked, but COME ON.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Nov 6, 2015 13:09:39 GMT -5
And honestly outside of Cena, most of the locker room guys *are* beneath them from an accomplishment standpoint And who's fault is that? When you have a company that consistently undermines the current group of guys and treats a bunch of relics from 15 years ago as the greatest thing ever...I mean again it's not the talents' fault that the company is stuck in the past. And it's too bad that Triple H and Undertaker aren't humble enough to see that their time is over, they as you said have done everything they can do. Yet they're still getting the main event. It's really easy for WWE to prove themselves right when they over control every aspect of their product and dismiss any alternative to what they do.
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mcstoklasa
Hank Scorpio
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Post by mcstoklasa on Nov 6, 2015 13:12:38 GMT -5
It's quite simple. If you want a part timer to win the rumble then it should be Brock. If you want a full time guy to win it must be a popular act the crowd will actually rally behind, so Ambrose.
So WWE, not Cena, Reigns, Batista, The Local Men, HHH, and whilst the crowd would probably cheer, not Rock either. There's part timer and then there's show up once a year part timers like Rock
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