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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 20, 2022 10:08:22 GMT -5
One, homophobia isn't an opinion. Two, was there? Like was there actually a period where people said 'no the guy who murdered his family was kind of a dick but f*** this guy more'? I'm sure you could run into a guy who thought that. There's always a guy. Wrestling is chock full of that guy who will say the most melted thing. But this is all news to me as a thing that happened on any scale. According to Warrior, he thought homosexuality wasn't as legitimate as hetereosexuality(his words). According to webster's dictionary, a fact is something that can be proven or disproven. Since it can't be proven that one is more legitimate than the other, Warrior's homophobic views are all his opinion. I can't say for sure if I've seen someone in the IWC compare Benoit to Warrior, but in general the hate is more geared towards Warrior, not just because he "didn't have the workratez," but also because of his racist and homophobic views, whereas with Benoit, many choose to separate the character from the performer. I guarantee if that was Warrior(or any non in-ring technician) who killed his wife and kids, that would just be another excuse to bash him. I'm not saying this applies to any one smark, but IME it's enough to take notice. No actually it can be proven. It can be proven that there is no difference in "legitimacy" between any kind of sexuality because that's not a thing. He was a bigot spewing nonsense. An opinion isn't something that devalues other human beings, that's a hatred. An opinion is something you have about a song or when you're shopping for a new table. Also I have seen plenty of people separate Warrior's beliefs from his character and still love the wild screamy man they grew up watching. Just like there's people who will say Hogan is still their favorite knowing full well what he said and that he meant it. I think you see more complaints about Warrior for twofold reasons. One is that WWE has continued trying to rehab his legacy, forcing his stuff back into the conversation every year. When you come up in conversation, you're going to be talked about, but that doesn't mean people are giving a pass to something because they don't talk about it. The other is that what Benoit did is so horrible that plenty of people just don't wanna f***ing talk about it. Warrior's homophobia is not as hurtful as murder, which is actually part of why it's something people feel more comfortable discussing at length. There's no reason for people to dredge up what happened with Benoit and talk about that again. Also that bit about how if Warrior killedh is family it'd be an excuse to bash him is. Really really f***ing gross wow.
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Post by sungod2020 on Apr 20, 2022 10:28:05 GMT -5
According to Warrior, he thought homosexuality wasn't as legitimate as hetereosexuality(his words). According to webster's dictionary, a fact is something that can be proven or disproven. Since it can't be proven that one is more legitimate than the other, Warrior's homophobic views are all his opinion. I can't say for sure if I've seen someone in the IWC compare Benoit to Warrior, but in general the hate is more geared towards Warrior, not just because he "didn't have the workratez," but also because of his racist and homophobic views, whereas with Benoit, many choose to separate the character from the performer. I guarantee if that was Warrior(or any non in-ring technician) who killed his wife and kids, that would just be another excuse to bash him. I'm not saying this applies to any one smark, but IME it's enough to take notice. No actually it can be proven. It can be proven that there is no difference in "legitimacy" between any kind of sexuality because that's not a thing. He was a bigot spewing nonsense. An opinion isn't something that devalues other human beings, that's a hatred. An opinion is something you have about a song or when you're shopping for a new table. Also I have seen plenty of people separate Warrior's beliefs from his character and still love the wild screamy man they grew up watching. Just like there's people who will say Hogan is still their favorite knowing full well what he said and that he meant it. I think you see more complaints about Warrior for twofold reasons. One is that WWE has continued trying to rehab his legacy, forcing his stuff back into the conversation every year. When you come up in conversation, you're going to be talked about, but that doesn't mean people are giving a pass to something because they don't talk about it. The other is that what Benoit did is so horrible that plenty of people just don't wanna f***ing talk about it. Warrior's homophobia is not as hurtful as murder, which is actually part of why it's something people feel more comfortable discussing at length. There's no reason for people to dredge up what happened with Benoit and talk about that again. Also that bit about how if Warrior killed is family it'd be an excuse to bash him is. Really really f***ing gross wow.How can it not be another reason to bash him? If you hate the character and performer playing it, it's alot easier to digest it, but when it's someone you love and adore, you want to look for reasons to explain his actions so you can still enjoy their work without feeling conflicted. It's human nature. Also, Warrior thought queering was invalid because they couldn't reproduce. How is that not an opinion? It maybe hateful and offensive, but since the invalidity of homosexuality can't be proven, it would be an opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 10:37:59 GMT -5
Big Cass was going through an illness when he was acting at his worse and Enzo will always have maturity problems but appears to have stayed out of trouble for a while now unless I've missed something, probably fitting that the CYN crew are probably going to replace them as the Jannettyesque washed up ex WWE guys in most peoples minds. Thats a good one...nZo made some stupid partying related decisions and it cost him his WWE career. I follow him and the family he has befriended on twitter and it is so uplifting to see this young girl so excited for uncle nZo to come over...He has beefed up a bit more and the guy has always been 100% on the mic...He deserves a spot in the big lights regardless of his past (Though I am not wildly familiar with who "EA All Day" is as a person I just don't remember him being involved in any other scandals besides the drama that cost him his job and the attempted trojan horse stupidity)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 10:39:58 GMT -5
Goldberg seems to be one of the most despised guys in the IWC. There are people who've been accused of rape/abuse/racism who get nowhere near the hate he does. He's a good dude who takes his wrestling character seriously and loves being a hero to kids. He's done an incredible amount of charity work for years. He's a happy family man with no personal scandals behind him. People hate him though because "he ended Bret Hart's career." Bret wrestled for weeks after that superkick, including a hardcore match with Terry Funk involving chairshots and matches with Nash and Sid were he had to take powerbombs. Those accumulated blows are the ones which forced him to retire. If he took a few weeks off until he was cleared rather than kept going he'd probably have been back by the next PPV and who knows how many more years he could have continued to wrestle for. Blame the doctors who let him keep wrestling rather than benching him for a few weeks to recuperate. Wrestlers, athletes and even a lot of doctors didn't take concussions seriously 20+ years ago. It's incredibly shitty to hold that over Goldberg's head and constantly be so vitriolic towards him, especially because you just know it wouldn't be the case if it was a guy the IWC loved. Then it would just be "accidents happen." There are countless beloved wrestlers who've stiffed, concussed, crippled or dropped opponents on their heads. I really appreciate this post. So many wrestlers who are legit criminals or hurt people on purpose seem to get less heat from the IWC than guys who politicked or hurt someone by accident Unfortunately this situation reappeared quickly with Ridge Holland...Social was a fn nightmare when Big E got hurt.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 10:51:56 GMT -5
From an outside the ring standpoint, I think too many people take their in ring opinions of The Miz and take them waaaaay too far. Because the dude seems genuinely awesome outside of the ring. Even in the ring, I've felt like the hate is way overblown. Miz consistently sells me on the idea that he's barely hanging on and giving his all. That counts for a lot in wrestling. Agreed if you are running a company as the owner you would want as many guys like the Miz as you could get honestly...The guy is rarely injured (evident by his talking smack rant), never a worrying liability, and toes the company line better than any man ever besides maybe CENA. The Miz dreamed of being a WWE superstar when he was a child and he is the embodiment of what he feels a "superstar" is and maybe...maybe... that is what irks people. The online narrative that the guy who wasn't even allowed to change in the same locker room as others was "handed" his legacy is insane.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 20, 2022 11:51:35 GMT -5
According to Warrior, he thought homosexuality wasn't as legitimate as hetereosexuality(his words). According to webster's dictionary, a fact is something that can be proven or disproven. Since it can't be proven that one is more legitimate than the other, Warrior's homophobic views are all his opinion. I can't say for sure if I've seen someone in the IWC compare Benoit to Warrior, but in general the hate is more geared towards Warrior, not just because he "didn't have the workratez," but also because of his racist and homophobic views, whereas with Benoit, many choose to separate the character from the performer. I guarantee if that was Warrior(or any non in-ring technician) who killed his wife and kids, that would just be another excuse to bash him. I'm not saying this applies to any one smark, but IME it's enough to take notice. No actually it can be proven. It can be proven that there is no difference in "legitimacy" between any kind of sexuality because that's not a thing. He was a bigot spewing nonsense. An opinion isn't something that devalues other human beings, that's a hatred. An opinion is something you have about a song or when you're shopping for a new table. Also I have seen plenty of people separate Warrior's beliefs from his character and still love the wild screamy man they grew up watching. Just like there's people who will say Hogan is still their favorite knowing full well what he said and that he meant it. I think you see more complaints about Warrior for twofold reasons. One is that WWE has continued trying to rehab his legacy, forcing his stuff back into the conversation every year. When you come up in conversation, you're going to be talked about, but that doesn't mean people are giving a pass to something because they don't talk about it. The other is that what Benoit did is so horrible that plenty of people just don't wanna f***ing talk about it. Warrior's homophobia is not as hurtful as murder, which is actually part of why it's something people feel more comfortable discussing at length. There's no reason for people to dredge up what happened with Benoit and talk about that again. Also that bit about how if Warrior killedh is family it'd be an excuse to bash him is. Really really f***ing gross wow. Warrior’s homophobia was back in 2005, when that sort of thing was more accepted. I’m not saying it’s right but that was the culture back then and I believe he apologized before his death. The Bobby Heenan thing I think he said out of pure anger after the Self destruction dvd was made and he was talking shit. Again, not right but I feel like it was more of a spur of the moment emotional response. I think Warrior chilled out during his final days
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 12:17:08 GMT -5
I think this should really kind of be tiered off, a bit.
The Benoit's of the wrestling world should not even be in the same sentence as guys who were probably just complicated assholes, like Warrior.
Things like Velveteen Dream, that really just depends on how hard you believe everyone is "innocent until proven guilty", because as someone else mentioned, those types of things are EXTREMELY hard to prosecute.
That being said, my choice is Jericho. Jericho is a wrestling genius and an okay frontman for a band, but otherwise he really does seem like kind of a lunkhead who's not that smart, and it gets him into trouble. I do think he's got a good heart, though.
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Post by sdoyle7798 on Apr 20, 2022 12:40:58 GMT -5
For the 80 year old alzheimer's patient talk, how many dementia/alzheimer's patients kill people? Please don't give me the Verne Gagne thing. That was most likely his brain thinking it was a wrestling match. Ill patients with dementia don't kill people on a regular basis. It is a work rate thing, just like why people blame Lex for Elizabeth's death but Macho's controlling ways of her, which drove her away from the marriage is rarely mentioned. Because of workrate. Macho entertained people. He loves wrestling and put in his all in wrestling. Lex was a guy with a great body who looked like a star but he didn't live, eat, sleep, drink wrestling and was just in it for the money so people crap on him. Even though he's spent many of his last few years trying to be a better person. Re: Verne - even if he didn't think he was wrestling and though he was just fighting, if he would have been of sound mind, what he did would have been involuntary manslaughter at worst. What Benoit did was legitimately attempt - and succeed at - double murder. So, yea, basically, I am agreeing with you, and just clarifying the Gagne thing a bit.
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Post by sdoyle7798 on Apr 20, 2022 12:42:33 GMT -5
According to Warrior, he thought homosexuality wasn't as legitimate as hetereosexuality(his words). According to webster's dictionary, a fact is something that can be proven or disproven. Since it can't be proven that one is more legitimate than the other, Warrior's homophobic views are all his opinion. I can't say for sure if I've seen someone in the IWC compare Benoit to Warrior, but in general the hate is more geared towards Warrior, not just because he "didn't have the workratez," but also because of his racist and homophobic views, whereas with Benoit, many choose to separate the character from the performer. I guarantee if that was Warrior(or any non in-ring technician) who killed his wife and kids, that would just be another excuse to bash him. I'm not saying this applies to any one smark, but IME it's enough to take notice. No actually it can be proven. It can be proven that there is no difference in "legitimacy" between any kind of sexuality because that's not a thing. He was a bigot spewing nonsense. An opinion isn't something that devalues other human beings, that's a hatred. An opinion is something you have about a song or when you're shopping for a new table. Also I have seen plenty of people separate Warrior's beliefs from his character and still love the wild screamy man they grew up watching. Just like there's people who will say Hogan is still their favorite knowing full well what he said and that he meant it. I think you see more complaints about Warrior for twofold reasons. One is that WWE has continued trying to rehab his legacy, forcing his stuff back into the conversation every year. When you come up in conversation, you're going to be talked about, but that doesn't mean people are giving a pass to something because they don't talk about it. The other is that what Benoit did is so horrible that plenty of people just don't wanna f***ing talk about it. Warrior's homophobia is not as hurtful as murder, which is actually part of why it's something people feel more comfortable discussing at length. There's no reason for people to dredge up what happened with Benoit and talk about that again. Also that bit about how if Warrior killedh is family it'd be an excuse to bash him is. Really really f***ing gross wow. It can still be his opinion. It can be a wrong, bigoted, f***ed up opinion (and it is), but still be his opinion.
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Apr 20, 2022 12:52:50 GMT -5
Ultimate Warrior made both bigoted claims and opinions. I don't like gay people is a bigoted opinion, which he said in the past. Gay sex will cause the apocalypse, which he also said, is a bigoted claim.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Apr 20, 2022 13:14:09 GMT -5
No actually it can be proven. It can be proven that there is no difference in "legitimacy" between any kind of sexuality because that's not a thing. He was a bigot spewing nonsense. An opinion isn't something that devalues other human beings, that's a hatred. An opinion is something you have about a song or when you're shopping for a new table. Also I have seen plenty of people separate Warrior's beliefs from his character and still love the wild screamy man they grew up watching. Just like there's people who will say Hogan is still their favorite knowing full well what he said and that he meant it. I think you see more complaints about Warrior for twofold reasons. One is that WWE has continued trying to rehab his legacy, forcing his stuff back into the conversation every year. When you come up in conversation, you're going to be talked about, but that doesn't mean people are giving a pass to something because they don't talk about it. The other is that what Benoit did is so horrible that plenty of people just don't wanna f***ing talk about it. Warrior's homophobia is not as hurtful as murder, which is actually part of why it's something people feel more comfortable discussing at length. There's no reason for people to dredge up what happened with Benoit and talk about that again. Also that bit about how if Warrior killed is family it'd be an excuse to bash him is. Really really f***ing gross wow.How can it not be another reason to bash him? If you hate the character and performer playing it, it's alot easier to digest it, but when it's someone you love and adore, you want to look for reasons to explain his actions so you can still enjoy their work without feeling conflicted. It's human nature. Also, Warrior thought queering was invalid because they couldn't reproduce. How is that not an opinion? It maybe hateful and offensive, but since the invalidity of homosexuality can't be proven, it would be an opinion. Because the validity of a person’s orientation shouldn’t be determined by whether they can reproduce or not. If it makes two consenting adults happy, it’s legitimate, period. To imply otherwise requires a prejudice. So yes, Warrior was a bigoted asshole for his remarks about LGBTQ+ people and he deserves all of his notoriety.
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Post by sungod2020 on Apr 20, 2022 14:24:48 GMT -5
How can it not be another reason to bash him? If you hate the character and performer playing it, it's alot easier to digest it, but when it's someone you love and adore, you want to look for reasons to explain his actions so you can still enjoy their work without feeling conflicted. It's human nature. Also, Warrior thought queering was invalid because they couldn't reproduce. How is that not an opinion? It maybe hateful and offensive, but since the invalidity of homosexuality can't be proven, it would be an opinion. Because the validity of a person’s orientation shouldn’t be determined by whether they can reproduce or not. If it makes two consenting adults happy, it’s legitimate, period. To imply otherwise requires a prejudice. So yes, Warrior was a bigoted asshole for his remarks about LGBTQ+ people and he deserves all of his notoriety. Right, and in Warrior's f***ed up, bigoted mind, he thought gays weren't legitimate because they couldn't reproduce, thus making it his opinion. Hell, now that I look at it even further, AJ Styles also has a homophobic, but because he puts on exciting matches, it's looked at as an afterthought. If they swapped movesets, would their(the IWCs) opinion change accordingly? Listen, I'm not saying Warrior's views are right or that I agree with it, or that the backlash isn't justified. I'm just saying the way he saw these things, no matter how far out there they were, dosen't have the same baggage as a man who murdered his wife and son. There's a reason Warrior's in the Hall of Fame and Benoit isn't and I'm sure we can all figure out why.
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Post by Mid-Carder on Apr 20, 2022 14:41:36 GMT -5
Goldberg seems to be one of the most despised guys in the IWC. There are people who've been accused of rape/abuse/racism who get nowhere near the hate he does. He's a good dude who takes his wrestling character seriously and loves being a hero to kids. He's done an incredible amount of charity work for years. He's a happy family man with no personal scandals behind him. People hate him though because "he ended Bret Hart's career." Bret wrestled for weeks after that superkick, including a hardcore match with Terry Funk involving chairshots and matches with Nash and Sid were he had to take powerbombs. Those accumulated blows are the ones which forced him to retire. If he took a few weeks off until he was cleared rather than kept going he'd probably have been back by the next PPV and who knows how many more years he could have continued to wrestle for. Blame the doctors who let him keep wrestling rather than benching him for a few weeks to recuperate. Wrestlers, athletes and even a lot of doctors didn't take concussions seriously 20+ years ago. It's incredibly shitty to hold that over Goldberg's head and constantly be so vitriolic towards him, especially because you just know it wouldn't be the case if it was a guy the IWC loved. Then it would just be "accidents happen." There are countless beloved wrestlers who've stiffed, concussed, crippled or dropped opponents on their heads. Agree completely about Goldberg, and Brock as well for many of the same reasons. There's a subsection of the IWC who thinks that "has other things in their life besides wrestling" equals "hates wrestling and its fans". Goldberg seems a decent guy and I'm glad he got a happier final run with WWE.
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Post by nickcave on Apr 20, 2022 14:55:56 GMT -5
chavo jr, all because of one promo by kurt angle in tna. Similarly: El Dandy, a very good wrestler who was treated like a loser joke partly because that was the default state for luchadors in WCW and therefore partly because of racism. And I am heartened that no one's thought to mention someone who would've been first on this list just a few years ago. I'll take this to mean most people really have turned around on him. But just in case anyone hasn't gotten the memo: Sean Waltman, by all accounts, got his shit completely together. (He's also dating a respected author and producer for Black-Ish???) It's incredible how much Waltman has been able to turn it around, he's still not even 50 yet. He got into the business incredibly young and with the way things were back then it's hard not to let that completely destroy you
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 20, 2022 15:17:59 GMT -5
I'm just saying the way he saw these things, no matter how far out there they were, dosen't have the same baggage as a man who murdered his wife and son. There's a reason Warrior's in the Hall of Fame and Benoit isn't and I'm sure we can all figure out why. And nobody is claiming they are, they're objecting to the comparison because it's an ugly comparison that seems to be made up of a bunch of projections and assumptions. Almost nobody would think that the homophobe is worse or even on the same level as the guy who murdered his family. The judgment call that somehow wrestling ability would be a factor in the public's repulsion of a man who murdered his family was your claim. Chris Benoit killed his family and scores of people buried fond memories of him forever and can't look back. He was my favorite wrestler. I haven't watched a moment of him since what happened. This idea he's seen on any kind of wide scale as better by any reasonable proportion of people is a massive projection and a really ugly comparison you've kept shoving out there with nothing to back up and it feels more and more like some kind of f***ed up gotcha to be like "People are only mad about Warrior's homophobia because he couldn't do flips". The claim that there is any comparison has been your projection this whole time. I'd endeavor to say plenty more people go back and watch Ultimate Warrior matches putting aside what he said than have ever gone to rewatch Benoit stuff. And no, it's not his opinion. People are entitled to opinions. People are not entitled to hatred. When you begin to hate on a group of people and 'delegitimize' them you are no longer in the realms of beliefs you can just keep on having.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Apr 20, 2022 15:24:58 GMT -5
Because the validity of a person’s orientation shouldn’t be determined by whether they can reproduce or not. If it makes two consenting adults happy, it’s legitimate, period. To imply otherwise requires a prejudice. So yes, Warrior was a bigoted asshole for his remarks about LGBTQ+ people and he deserves all of his notoriety. Right, and in Warrior's f***ed up, bigoted mind, he thought gays weren't legitimate because they couldn't reproduce, thus making it his opinion. Hell, now that I look at it even further, AJ Styles also has a homophobic, but because he puts on exciting matches, it's looked at as an afterthought. If they swapped movesets, would their(the IWCs) opinion change accordingly? Listen, I'm not saying Warrior's views are right or that I agree with it, or that the backlash isn't justified. I'm just saying the way he saw these things, no matter how far out there they were, dosen't have the same baggage as a man who murdered his wife and son. There's a reason Warrior's in the Hall of Fame and Benoit isn't and I'm sure we can all figure out why. Well the thing with the Benoit killings and their fallout is that they were such a devastating blow to WWE's immediate public image in 2007, so I'm not surprised they took extra steps to honor him even less than their other controversial legends. Benoit's not in the hall because luckily homophobia is something that can be unlearned, where there's not much to do for public redemption after a double murder-suicide. Everyone probably won't have the same standards on who should be booted from the HOF, it's just something the company chooses to play by ear. Now if AJ still holds those attitudes, then he's an idiot. It wouldn't affect my feeling he is a talented performer on TV but I can still separate that if he couldn't tolerate people loving whomever they choose.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 20, 2022 15:28:55 GMT -5
As far as AJ goes, personally the dude's homophobia is a huge turn-off. I don't like the guy. But he has kept his idiot mouth shut since then so if I truck into every AJ Styles thread like "bluh he's a homophobe dumb dumb head" at some point I'm gonna get told off by the mods for saying the same shit every thread, or just develop a reputation for being the hugest bummer in the world, so I stay quiet. I don't even watch the company he's in anyway, it has no bearing on me. If you gathered up me and everyone else who feels the same, I'm sure you'd get a decent number of people, and we'd form the AJ Styles Homophobia Megathread and it'd make it to like half a page before we're posting pictures of cheese wheels because there's just nothing to say on the topic.
I dunno, the persistent whataboutism with that kind of thing always feels like you're just admitting publicly that you lack object permanence, I don't think it's as good a flex as people think it is.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 15:32:56 GMT -5
As far as AJ goes, personally the dude's homophobia is a huge turn-off. I don't like the guy. But he has kept his idiot mouth shut since then so if I truck into every AJ Styles thread like "bluh he's a homophobe dumb dumb head" at some point I'm gonna get told off by the mods for saying the same shit every thread, or just develop a reputation for being the hugest bummer in the world, so I stay quiet. I don't even watch the company he's in anyway, it has no bearing on me. If you gathered up me and everyone else who feels the same, I'm sure you'd get a decent number of people, and we'd form the AJ Styles Homophobia Megathread and it'd make it to like half a page before we're posting pictures of cheese wheels because there's just nothing to say on the topic. I dunno, the persistent whataboutism with that kind of thing always feels like you're just admitting publicly that you lack object permanence, I don't think it's as good a flex as people think it is. I am going to stay very very light with this so it doesn't come off like an excuse and just go with personal perspective and experience growing up and then returning to settle down in small town Illinois... As sad as it sounds in 2022 acceptance of the LGBTQ+ community is still very much a hot button topic in various religions and households in rural areas and I truly think people get torn between what they have been taught forever and what their heart tells them is right. I am not justifying homophobia whatsoever but I have never been too bothered (likely cause i deal with it daily and in my own family) by people who straight say "I don't believe in it" and leave it at that due to what they have been taught as opposed to the people that attack people for who they are based on some perceive moral superiority. That situation may be a little bit of the reason why a guy like AJ may get a pass over Warrior because even though he may not believe he isn't aggressive about it. It's a very murky land that is handled amazingly here at this forum thankfully...Other places online not so much...I guess the weird point I am trying to make is it is possible to be wrong, ignorant (/uneducated), and a decent person all at the same time...
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Apr 20, 2022 15:45:46 GMT -5
Ultimate Warrior He had a rough childhood, made something of himself. Was going to become I believe a chiropractor and did bodybuilding...got into wrestling just to make some $ on the side. Created a legendary character, has absolutely no background, knowledge, or understanding of the world of wrestling (or athletics) but manages to carve out a place for himself. Ends up in the WWF, His look, energy, and character resonate with the fans so they push him to the moon. Everyone around him is jealous and spiteful towards him because this guy who never had any desire to be involved in wrestling is now more over than they will ever be He never had any reverence or love of the business simply because he saw how destructive and dangerous it was. He hated the traveling, he hated how it ruined lives and how cutthroat it was. He just wanted to get his while he could (big main event $) be wise with it...and get out of and do what he wanted to do. Of course he could be a jerk, a huge jerk, and a hypocrite. But he also knew exactly what he wanted to get out of his run, his character....he did that, and he lived the life he wanted with his wife and kids. He never stopped trying to better himself. He was a flawed man but never even close to the irrational asshole nutcase he was slandered as by many. He knew himself that the business wasnt for him even at the height of his popularity, and I think he tried to do what was necessary so that he wouldnt have to end up like Flair. Be smart with your money, be there for your wife and children He f***ed over a lot of people though. Like, when Vegas finally had a thriving mid-90s indy (NWC) at a time when the business in general was doing terrible, he convinced the promoter to make him a partner and then proceeded to steal from it and destroy it. That's actively irredeemable beyond "this guy is tough to work with." And then you have how many fans he f***ed over up through the last year of his life by lying to them about the history of different replica belts. If you sell at least four different people the belt that you're claiming was *the* belt you won at Wrestlemania VI - and the moment of when you're selling it to them is your supposed "changed" twilight years - you're a piece of shit. Also, if you ever read his essays or listened to his speeches, if anyone is to blame for him sounding like an "irrational asshole nutcase" it's the man himself who thought posting all that shit for years was a good idea. Comes back to the thread topic. Any number of charlatans in pro-wrestling have ripped off folk - be it wrestlers running a wrestling school (like Smith Hart), or the fellow that vanished on a young Taker after pocketing $3k to train him (forget his name), or promoters stiffing guys on pay. To my knowledge Warrior did the dirty on a grand total of $7k in Vegas, yet some like Heyman is praised when he did the dirty to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars, yet Warrior is being vilified and Heyman has a "great mind for the business", so it's OK. I remember the belt auctions and he was advertising "ring worn" titles, not necessarily Wrestlemania 6 belt itself. He had multiple coloured belts made for him for house shows and TV tapings. But I could be wrong and the sources for this are on webpages I don't want to wander into without getting malicious software on my device. Yes he had a shitty opinion on a lot of things and made bad business decisions but that's the extent of it - comparatively small fries to the stuff in the industry but feels like Warrior is put up on a pedestal of assholes ahead, undeservedly, of far worse individuals.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2022 15:53:49 GMT -5
I don't think there's a tier.
Warrior is a piece of shit.
Benoit is a piece of shit.
Its not a contest.
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