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Post by oxbaker on May 3, 2022 17:32:13 GMT -5
You really think a company as stringent with their money right now is just gonna hand out money to women to go out and get high fashion dresses and shoes etc? That sounds like something a sugar daddy does for sexual favors in return. The Performance Center doesn't have enough lockers and WWE is culling people left and right but yeah sure they must be altruistically making high fashion dreams come true, and the fact the only woman who's commented publicly on said meetings framed them highly negatively is just to be brushed aside in all of this. Also there's something funky to me about using examples from an article called "WNBA’S MOST FASHIONABLE PLAYERS" and being like 'Yeah this is normal across the board'. It's singling out the most stylish of these players on a fashion article. That's going to drum up some pretty inherent biases. Also I don't wanna assume anyone's genders just because they're omitted but the fact that nobody who's openly female-presenting on their profile is like 'Yeah this is normal this feels above board' reads kinda damning to me as a sub-point. It has been reported, actually from some years ago, that the NXT women got paid above the men for wardrobe needs. That’s true also in TV news and other things. Fashion is part of the job. If that’s changed at WWE, no one has reported it. And weren’t the ‘locker shortage’ reports from a time when the main roster was using the same facilities during pandemic times? Can you provide a contemporary report that it’s an issue today?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2022 17:37:31 GMT -5
But this is not simply about women dressing sexy especially on their own time this is about it being tied to their career progression....you can freely argue this is how women I see everyday dress or on Instagram(that is a terrible example by the way since Instagrams entire purpose is thottery). We are talking about the edict within the company...and the photos are a perfect example of that change and this is what Ember Moon was saying and that is the problem again exemplified in the photos. WNBA women I am sure are not called into a meeting for 2hrs and told dress sexier but then get benched because they did not adhere to the advice. I mean look at who is being pushed....Nikkita , Toxic Attraction, Tiffany Stratton it ain't IMO difficult to connect the dots from what Ember is saying to what we are seeing on screen with the women. If it came out that women are getting depushed for not dressing sexy that's f***ed up but that isn't what Ember suggested lol. You implied that. But it literally makes sense why they're pushing those women. Nikitta like it or not is getting over. They should be pushing her. Tiffany Stratton is a young blonde with the potential to replace Lacey Evans & Charlotte as both those women are in their 30s & who knows how long they'll be doing it much longer. Every company even AEW like their blonde women to push lol Toxic Attraction 3 women who have a lot of potential on the main roster with Jacy & Gigi both having experience on the indies but also being super young. Your favorite(lol) Lash Legend has great size & they want a young black woman to mold into their next Bianca or Sasha and she's 24. Like I get it, you're annoyed because they're not pushing your faves but every woman they're pushing hard in NXT has super valid reasons why they're getting a push and it isn't just because they're hot. Oh so this is where you are taking this now...even though I have mentioned Io all of once an example that included Ember and Sarray in what I was saying alright cool. You and I will part ways on this topic now.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 3, 2022 17:41:04 GMT -5
The Performance Center doesn't have enough lockers and WWE is culling people left and right but yeah sure they must be altruistically making high fashion dreams come true, and the fact the only woman who's commented publicly on said meetings framed them highly negatively is just to be brushed aside in all of this. Also there's something funky to me about using examples from an article called "WNBA’S MOST FASHIONABLE PLAYERS" and being like 'Yeah this is normal across the board'. It's singling out the most stylish of these players on a fashion article. That's going to drum up some pretty inherent biases. Also I don't wanna assume anyone's genders just because they're omitted but the fact that nobody who's openly female-presenting on their profile is like 'Yeah this is normal this feels above board' reads kinda damning to me as a sub-point. It has been reported, actually from some years ago, that the NXT women got paid above the men for wardrobe needs. That’s true also in TV news and other things. Fashion is part of the job. If that’s changed at WWE, no one has reported it. And weren’t the ‘locker shortage’ reports from a time when the main roster was using the same facilities during pandemic times? Can you provide a contemporary report that it’s an issue today? I remember those reports being that they paid women more for make-up, specifically. Not for clothing. A stipend for fashionable clothing would absolutely be news to me. And frankly, fashion was not part of the job on NXT up until partway through last year. Not in the ways it's being discussed now. Most of the women did not dress like the pictures being thrown around. Far as lockers, I dunno, that was just what was reported. If that's changed at WWE, nobody has reported it.
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Post by 06vwgti on May 3, 2022 17:51:45 GMT -5
The Performance Center doesn't have enough lockers and WWE is culling people left and right but yeah sure they must be altruistically making high fashion dreams come true, and the fact the only woman who's commented publicly on said meetings framed them highly negatively is just to be brushed aside in all of this. Also there's something funky to me about using examples from an article called "WNBA’S MOST FASHIONABLE PLAYERS" and being like 'Yeah this is normal across the board'. It's singling out the most stylish of these players on a fashion article. That's going to drum up some pretty inherent biases. Also I don't wanna assume anyone's genders just because they're omitted but the fact that nobody who's openly female-presenting on their profile is like 'Yeah this is normal this feels above board' reads kinda damning to me as a sub-point. It has been reported, actually from some years ago, that the NXT women got paid above the men for wardrobe needs. That’s true also in TV news and other things. Fashion is part of the job. If that’s changed at WWE, no one has reported it. And weren’t the ‘locker shortage’ reports from a time when the main roster was using the same facilities during pandemic times? Can you provide a contemporary report that it’s an issue today? Link to the article on the NXT women getting paid above men for wardrobe needs?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2022 18:02:43 GMT -5
If you don't think there's a double standard at work...
do you think there'd be a woman-wrestler like Rikishi in NXT 2.0, ever?
Do you think they're telling the men to wrestle in some tighter trunks, really show off that package to draw in the viewers?
Hell, what was the last men's wrestling character with a gimmick of "I'm hot"? Tyler Breeze?
This is a "dress code", not a dress code, if you get my drift.
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Post by mistery on May 3, 2022 18:03:10 GMT -5
Like I said, it's awfully suspicious that women like Toxic Attraction, Tiffany, Nikkita, Lash etc are all being pushed all at the same time while women like Io, Sarray, Dakota (although she was released so its a moot point), etc are all being shoved to the side. Especially since Johnny Ace has regained power, and pretty much every wrestling historian will tell you he was a massive creep on top of being really bad at his job of actually picking out talented wrestlers who have a future on the main roster.
And no, not all of them don't have good reasons to be getting pushed other than they likely get Johnny all hot and bothered at this point. Especially Lash Legend who is just completely and utterly terrible, and is someone I don't think anyone ever truly expects to improve at this point, especially since she's been in the company for AT LEAST a year at this point.
Ember is pointing out that there are unfair standards going on in NXT at the moment regarding the women and she's 100% right. You should be pushed at how well you do your job. Not based on how much of a boner you give Johnny Ace or another executive. If you want to push Tiffany or whatever that's fine, but it shouldn't be coming at the expense of women like Sarray, who are just as deserving of a push. The only difference is that Sarray isn't attractive enough to WWE/Johnny apparently.
This is why the women's division in WWE is pretty much completely toast the moment several of the horsewomen and Asuka retire. Because its a bunch of green women getting pushed instead of WWE slowing down on them until they are ready (along with not actually hiring talented women's wrestlers and trying to go after former athletes instead). And the women's division in NXT is absolutely toast if someone like Io and KLR leave, as they are the only really super great hands they have left right now for the women.
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Post by oxbaker on May 3, 2022 18:06:52 GMT -5
It has been reported, actually from some years ago, that the NXT women got paid above the men for wardrobe needs. That’s true also in TV news and other things. Fashion is part of the job. If that’s changed at WWE, no one has reported it. And weren’t the ‘locker shortage’ reports from a time when the main roster was using the same facilities during pandemic times? Can you provide a contemporary report that it’s an issue today? Link to the article on the NXT women getting paid above men for wardrobe needs? It was reported years ago about how the women were making more and it was a topic of discussion on message boards. I didn’t save the link lol. Another poster remembers it differently than me — he says it was only makeup — but that should be confirmation enough to you that I’m not making it up.
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Post by 06vwgti on May 3, 2022 18:08:50 GMT -5
Link to the article on the NXT women getting paid above men for wardrobe needs? It was reported years ago about how the women were making more and it was a topic of discussion on message boards. I didn’t save the link lol. Another poster remembers it differently than me — he says it was only makeup — but that should be confirmation enough to you that I’m not making it up. Didn't say you weren't making it up (which it seems you are implying), just wanted to read the article if you knew about it or could find it for the rest of us since you mentioned it.
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Post by oxbaker on May 3, 2022 18:21:46 GMT -5
It was reported years ago about how the women were making more and it was a topic of discussion on message boards. I didn’t save the link lol. Another poster remembers it differently than me — he says it was only makeup — but that should be confirmation enough to you that I’m not making it up. Didn't say you weren't making it up (which it seems you are implying), just wanted to read the article if you knew about it or could find it for the rest of us since you mentioned it. Sorry if I misunderstood your intent. It was some years ago. It wasn’t a major deal but it was something Meltzer or someone mentioned in a report. I can’t find it. It wasn’t a major deal or a major amount, but my memory is that they got a few thousand a year more (maybe $5K-ish?) because of expectation/expense of things of a cosmetic nature that the men didn’t need like makeup and clothing for appearances and such. I know this is true in the TV industry for female news reporters because a guy can own a few suits and just change up the tie/shirt color combination every day and nobody notices but a female wouldn’t wear the same green or blue dress/blouse twice in two or three weeks. I know a few people in that industry and even at the local level they get stipends.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 3, 2022 18:23:13 GMT -5
It was reported years ago about how the women were making more and it was a topic of discussion on message boards. I didn’t save the link lol. Another poster remembers it differently than me — he says it was only makeup — but that should be confirmation enough to you that I’m not making it up. Didn't say you weren't making it up (which it seems you are implying), just wanted to read the article if you knew about it or could find it for the rest of us since you mentioned it. My part, unfortunately, comes from an offhand comment on Observer Radio. Dave was talking about NXT base contracts and just made an offhand remark that they pay women a bit more than the men relatively so they can afford make-up. I don't know that it was even one that went up on Youtube either so it may be lost to the depths of the Wrestling Observer archives and to being totally implacable in terms of when or why it was brought up.
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Post by oxbaker on May 3, 2022 18:24:09 GMT -5
Like I said, it's awfully suspicious that women like Toxic Attraction, Tiffany, Nikkita, Lash etc are all being pushed all at the same time while women like Io, Sarray, Dakota (although she was released so its a moot point), etc are all being shoved to the side. Especially since Johnny Ace has regained power, and pretty much every wrestling historian will tell you he was a massive creep on top of being really bad at his job of actually picking out talented wrestlers who have a future on the main roster. Irony being Dakota seemed to opt for a sexier look with the black leather studded bra and trousers a few times toward the end. Assuming it was an attempt at a sexier look, a person can try to find some common ground with what makes them feel okay and what management wants and if Johnny Ace isn't impressed it means nothing. From what I’ve read with Dakota it was just a matter of her being around NXT for more than 5 years and they didn’t see her as being someone who could make the jump to the main roster.
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Post by mistery on May 3, 2022 18:25:52 GMT -5
Didn't say you weren't making it up (which it seems you are implying), just wanted to read the article if you knew about it or could find it for the rest of us since you mentioned it. Sorry if I misunderstood your intent. It was some years ago. It wasn’t a major deal but it was something Meltzer or someone mentioned in a report. I can’t find it. It wasn’t a major deal or a major amount, but my memory is that they got a few thousand a year more (maybe $5K-ish?) because of expectation/expense of things of a cosmetic nature that the men didn’t need like makeup and clothing for appearances and such. I know this is true in the TV industry for female news reporters because a guy can own a few suits and just change up the tie/shirt color combination every day and nobody notices but a female wouldn’t wear the same green or blue dress/blouse twice in two or three weeks. I know a few people in that industry and even at the local level they get stipends. Yeah. That might have been in the old days, but I know KAIRI (fka Kairi Sane) did an interview (with a Japanese news site) after leaving WWE, mentioning that WWE did not cover wardrobe expenses or anything while she was in NXT. And that Io had told her they still didn't as of a couple of months ago. That talent is expected to go out and buy outfits on their own budget. They don't get paid extra or anything to cover those expenses. Kairi specifically mentioned the only things WWE covered while in NXT is transportation (as they traveled by bus when it comes to national tours) and lodging (both locally and on tour).
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on May 3, 2022 18:31:45 GMT -5
Irony being Dakota seemed to opt for a sexier look with the black leather studded bra and trousers a few times toward the end. Assuming it was an attempt at a sexier look, a person can try to find some common ground with what makes them feel okay and what management wants and if Johnny Ace isn't impressed it means nothing. From what I’ve read with Dakota it was just a matter of her being around NXT for more than 5 years and they didn’t see her as being someone who could make the jump to the main roster. And part of that is her look. I don't really know what we're arguing here. Obviously looks matter in WWE and moreso for the women. You can argue if it should be that way and to what extent but it is what it is. There's a reason Dakota didn't get called up whereas Aliyah did. Despite the gap in the ring and a gay I see in terms of charisma, Aliyah has the better look in their eyes and got the call.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 3, 2022 18:32:21 GMT -5
Also while demanding make-up is one thing already, being like "Here's extra money buy sexy hot mega hot clothes we'll teach you how to fashion like we want" to only the women is. Still sleazy and part of the whole "huh it really feels like no women are defending this at all I wonder if that means something" vibe.
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Post by mistery on May 4, 2022 6:53:28 GMT -5
After last night's NXT, Ember is looking more and more correct by the day about sex appeal being the most important factor, to the detriment of everything else when it comes to the women. Hell, you can just look at NXT Level Up spoilers from last night and see that to be the truth as well. And people wonder why NXT is starting to be seen as the worst weekly WWE show now. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{SPOILER: CLICK TO SHOW}Where they had Sarray job out not only to Ivy Nile, but Tatum Paxley as well. Happy Asian Pacific Islander appreciation month, everyone! I think the POST Wrestling guys brought up a good point in that the constant horniness is an absolute turnoff and is actively driving viewers away from the product at this point. And that they would be shocked if ratings continue to trend as low as they have been, if NXT actually gets a new deal when their current one is up. And with them cutting women like Dakota Kai, they clearly don't care about the quality of the women's stuff down there anymore. With all of the angles being utterly terrible right now, it's not even worthy of being on Peacock either.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 21,689
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Post by asuka007 on May 4, 2022 9:59:49 GMT -5
It does not seem to be bringing in many “younger viewers” at least, which is what they allegedly want.
A huge chunk of their viewership skews quite old.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2022 13:47:02 GMT -5
It does not seem to be bringing in many “younger viewers” at least, which is what they allegedly want. A huge chunk of their viewership skews quite old. That's because, to be perfectly blunt about it, those of us that want to see scantily clad women (sometimes not even clad at all!) can hop on the internet and get it in literal seconds. Sure, sex might sell and having one or two wrestlers that play the vamp type of character is smart for catching eyes, but it still has to be about other kinds of characters, and you know, wrestling. It's not 1998 anymore.
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Post by polarbearpete on May 4, 2022 15:06:09 GMT -5
After last night's NXT, Ember is looking more and more correct by the day about sex appeal being the most important factor, to the detriment of everything else when it comes to the women. Hell, you can just look at NXT Level Up spoilers from last night and see that to be the truth as well. And people wonder why NXT is starting to be seen as the worst weekly WWE show now. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{SPOILER: CLICK TO SHOW}Where they had Sarray job out not only to Ivy Nile, but Tatum Paxley as well. Happy Asian Pacific Islander appreciation month, everyone! I think the POST Wrestling guys brought up a good point in that the constant horniness is an absolute turnoff and is actively driving viewers away from the product at this point. And that they would be shocked if ratings continue to trend as low as they have been, if NXT actually gets a new deal when their current one is up. And with them cutting women like Dakota Kai, they clearly don't care about the quality of the women's stuff down there anymore. With all of the angles being utterly terrible right now, it's not even worthy of being on Peacock either. I know you like Sarray but what about Ivy Nile says they’re pushing sex appeal or something. She’s pushed as a badass. Also, best viewership in 4 months for last nights episode.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on May 4, 2022 18:43:20 GMT -5
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knsffa
Team Rocket
Missed This Place and People
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Post by knsffa on May 4, 2022 18:55:18 GMT -5
Question about the 30-90 day window on releases. Back in 2020 when Drake and Heath got released, they brought Heath back for a RAW as apparently the contracts said for those 90 or 30 days they could still use people they let go. The same with Drake, though he got resigned soon after and they turned it into a storyline. Can they still do that? Or did that get changed?
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