Punk Scrum Thread II: Punk terminated from AEW

[dreidemy]

Collision has been great and I'm gonna Wait & See where this REAL WORLD TITLE stuff goes now with a clearly heel CM Punk and face-ish MJF

[thegatewaydrug]

Luckily, Phil doesn't have any real Broadcast Journalists refuting or legitimizing his claim as the Real World's Champion.

Allegedly, he was seen backstage on Saturday with green fingers after pulling the belt from his bag.

[Dan Royal]

Jul 30, 2023 9:43:25 GMT -5 SneakMan said:

Jul 30, 2023 8:28:13 GMT -5 firsttimelongtime said:

Look at the visceral reaction to how he’s booked. People hate him. In a way we hardly ever see. And that’s okay! I like when people feel strongly about wrestling. The magic has returned.

I didn’t realize that using Punk’s promos as bathroom breaks, or actively skipping over his matches whenever possible, meant I was getting worked. Who knew?

I mean ok. But personally I went to the show in Calgary, and Punk was defeniletely the biggest contributing factor on me going. I might have gone anyway, but Punk being there made the decision to spend $150 a ticket and drive 2 hours a bit easier.


And judging by the reaction he got that night both positive and negative. Their were a lot of people there who also paid a decent chunk of money to see him.

[polarbearpete]

Jul 30, 2023 21:38:57 GMT -5 cjb01: Limited Edition Item! said:

Jul 30, 2023 20:47:51 GMT -5 tenshi said:

A big critique about AEW is that it's a place where people get in positions of power and get preferential treatment for themselves and their buddies. People like The Elite and Jericho are usually mentioned as examples of this so it's good to see that Tony Khan is "beating the allegations" by putting CM Punk in a position of power and gets preferential treatment for him and his friends...

I don't trust Wade Keller, like at all, so I don't really trust this report, but everyone in AEW has say in their storylines, one of the biggest things about it is having creative freedom and the ability to do things in a less confined space

Punk always had control of his storylines, so did other people, I get that people want that to change because of what Punk did but it didn't, but it's the same for a lot of other wrestlers, I don't really see preferential treatment here, and again, I do not trust basically anything Keller says so... yeah.

Why the complete distrust of Keller’s reports?

[Denny Zen is Cooking™]

I strongly dislike this storyline. If you look at my post history, the whole "I'm the real champion" thing is exactly what I didn't want AEW to do when Punk came back and Collision became his de facto "own show." This storyline undermines MJF, undermines the real world championship, and is negatively affecting my enjoyment of AEW as a whole. 

That said, throughout its existence, AEW has always done a pretty good job paying storylines off in a satisfying way, so I'm willing to begrudgingly give it a chance and see where it goes. But, if this ends any other way than MJF beating CM Punk in a feud and "unifying" the titles, I am probably done with AEW for a bit. If it ends with there being a separate and distinct "Collision championship," I am definitely done for a while. There being 3 different "world championships" is my least favorite feature of WWE, and I really don't want to see that nonsense bleed over into AEW. 

[markymark]

This should definitely heat things up lol

[cjb01: Limited Edition Item!]

Jul 31, 2023 8:51:32 GMT -5 polarbearpete said:

Jul 30, 2023 21:38:57 GMT -5 cjb01: Limited Edition Item! said:

I don't trust Wade Keller, like at all, so I don't really trust this report, but everyone in AEW has say in their storylines, one of the biggest things about it is having creative freedom and the ability to do things in a less confined space

Punk always had control of his storylines, so did other people, I get that people want that to change because of what Punk did but it didn't, but it's the same for a lot of other wrestlers, I don't really see preferential treatment here, and again, I do not trust basically anything Keller says so... yeah.

Why the complete distrust of Keller’s reports?

Some past stuff with Keller and PWTorch hasn't set right with me in the slightest nor has it all been entirely accurate in the end to how he's spun it. So when he posts negative stories I don't take them as gospel.

There could be truth to it, but when it comes to Dirtsheets anymore I'm really cautious, and tbh when it comes to any news about what Punk's doing the Dirtsheets wore me out considerably on what's actually happening tbh

[Hypnosis]

Jul 31, 2023 9:54:43 GMT -5 markymark said:

This should definitely heat things up lol

[Fade]

Jul 31, 2023 9:54:43 GMT -5 markymark said:

This should definitely heat things up lol

Brand Warfare, Maggle!

[HMARK Center]

Yeah, hate to say it guys, but seeing Punk live at Forbidden Door and Collision, the crowd is very invested in him, whether to cheer or to boo.

I don't personally care that much; I liked his Kojima match a lot, and I get people not liking having Cena flashbacks with "he's acting like a face but getting booed" (or in some cases "he's acting like a heel but getting cheered") stuff or whatever, but he's getting major, very loud reactions and it means they're gonna lean into it.

I'm ok with giving some of it more time, too; Ricky cheating just started, he hasn't done anything so far beyond the pale that it makes him an irredeemable scumbag against noble, saintly Punk, and Punk's gladly leaned into playing heelish since this comeback, too. And anything that doesn't impact on-screen stuff in a negative way is something I can't be arsed to care about at the moment.

[Kalmia]

I could not care less if 99% of the crowd are hot on an angle. If I don't like it, I don't like it. If I think it's dumb, I'm still going to think it's dumb even if I'm a lone voice. And vice versa, me loving something isn't going to be diminished by the crowd hating it.

Bringing up crowd reactions when someone talks about their personal opinion on something always confuses me because it's pointless. Crowd reactions to a wrestler or angle are for AEW to care about, not me.

If people are saying Punk should be taken off TV because nobody cares then sure, bring up crowd reactions and gate receipts. If they say that they as an individual don't care, then crowd reaction has nothing to do with it.

It's kinda ironic considering Punk was the "voice of the voiceless". In this case, the voiceless are literally those who'll make no noise when he comes out to the ring, lmao

[markymark]

The part from Forgot About Dre he chose to use:

"Y'all are the reason that Dre ain't been getting no sleep So fk y'all, all of y'all If y'all don't like me, blow me Y'all are gon' keep fking around with me and turn me back to the old me"

[The Ichi]

Jul 31, 2023 11:14:33 GMT -5 Kalmia said:

I could not care less if 99% of the crowd are hot on an angle. If I don't like it, I don't like it. If I think it's dumb, I'm still going to think it's dumb even if I'm a lone voice. And vice versa, me loving something isn't going to be diminished by the crowd hating it.

Bringing up crowd reactions when someone talks about their personal opinion on something always confuses me because it's pointless. Crowd reactions to a wrestler or angle are for AEW to care about, not me.

If people are saying Punk should be taken off TV because nobody cares then sure, bring up crowd reactions and gate receipts. If they say that they as an individual don't care, then crowd reaction has nothing to do with it.

It's kinda ironic considering Punk was the "voice of the voiceless". In this case, the voiceless are literally those who'll make no noise when he comes out to the ring, lmao

Yeah. "B-but crowd reactions!" is weird and only seems to occur in wrestling discourse. If I think a guy sucks, that's the end of it lol. Ditto the opposite side of the coin.

And I'm sorry, but I don't see the Cena Zero Sugar reactions he's been getting as any kind of success, and you're not going to convince me that TK wanted it exactly this way either.

[markymark]

[HMARK Center]

Jul 31, 2023 12:33:51 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

Jul 31, 2023 11:14:33 GMT -5 Kalmia said:

I could not care less if 99% of the crowd are hot on an angle. If I don't like it, I don't like it. If I think it's dumb, I'm still going to think it's dumb even if I'm a lone voice. And vice versa, me loving something isn't going to be diminished by the crowd hating it.

Bringing up crowd reactions when someone talks about their personal opinion on something always confuses me because it's pointless. Crowd reactions to a wrestler or angle are for AEW to care about, not me.

If people are saying Punk should be taken off TV because nobody cares then sure, bring up crowd reactions and gate receipts. If they say that they as an individual don't care, then crowd reaction has nothing to do with it.

It's kinda ironic considering Punk was the "voice of the voiceless". In this case, the voiceless are literally those who'll make no noise when he comes out to the ring, lmao

Yeah. "B-but crowd reactions!" is weird and only seems to occur in wrestling discourse. If I think a guy sucks, that's the end of it lol. Ditto the opposite side of the coin.

And I'm sorry, but I don't see the Cena Zero Sugar reactions he's been getting as any kind of success, and you're not going to convince me that TK wanted it exactly this way either.

It's fine if someone doesn't like it, but calling it bad TV or saying it's bad business if AEW pursues it is where the discourse goes off track.

Hell, I didn't even like the Rock back circa 1999, I know all about not liking something that's doing gangbuster business.

[The Ichi]

Jul 31, 2023 13:26:39 GMT -5 HMARK Center said:

Jul 31, 2023 12:33:51 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

Yeah. "B-but crowd reactions!" is weird and only seems to occur in wrestling discourse. If I think a guy sucks, that's the end of it lol. Ditto the opposite side of the coin.

And I'm sorry, but I don't see the Cena Zero Sugar reactions he's been getting as any kind of success, and you're not going to convince me that TK wanted it exactly this way either.

It's fine if someone doesn't like it, but calling it bad TV or saying it's bad business if AEW pursues it is where the discourse goes off track.

Hell, I didn't even like the Rock back circa 1999, I know all about not liking something that's doing gangbuster business.

For me I see it as both good and bad business, or good business with a huge monkey's paw attached to it.

Obviously Punk can still put eyes on the product, nobody's denying that (although not to the extent that was maybe promised but I'll leave that can of worms sealed). The other side of that coin is the fact that he's proven to be a thin-skinnned ticking timebomb that's already driven back months worth of booking plans once, and has come back not exactly doubling down on that behaviour but not showing regret for it either. If an incident like that happens again, that's another several weeks/months worth of planning and booking gone. And I guess that's my worry, the impending feeling of that happening again.

So yes, Punk is still a draw, but time will tell if the risk if worth the reward.

[markymark]

While many fans online have taken sides between Punk and The Elite, Fuego Del Sol said it's not like that in the locker room.

"There’s a whole thing online where you have to pick a side between CM Punk and The Elite, that’s not how it is in the back. You have really close friends of The Elite that are like, ‘Hey, I’m with you guys, I’m riding with you guys.’ There’s really close friends of Punk that are going to side with Punk. I haven’t revealed this to anybody, CM Punk hurt his foot last year. I hurt my foot in February, Punk messaged me multiple times a week checking on me. Regardless of anyone wants to say about him, I only go off of interactions that I’ve had with people and he checked on me constantly, and I’m forever grateful for that. If I ever had any questions before a show, Punk was always there, especially during his first run. I haven’t really been there much since Punk has come back, I don’t know how he’s been, I’m not gonna speak for anyone else’s opinion on him. However, I have to turn around and say the Bucks have been phenomenal to me. From day one, they’ve treated me like a brother, a wrestler, one of the boys. They never treated me like an extra, they never acted like they were above me because they were EVPs, they’ve checked on me since I’ve got hurt and since I’ve got released, I’ve got messages from both Matt and Nick saying, ‘We had no clue, we’re so sorry. We wish the best for you.’ I’ve had great interactions with everyone, more so the Bucks and Punk than Kenny, but Kenny does a lot of stuff with the female division. But anytime I had questions about going to Japan or about my matches, he was incredibly nice. There’s a lot of talk and heat about the butting heads at the top, but a lot of our top guys really want the best for the industry," Fuego told Nick Hausman on Haus of Wrestling.

He continued, “The first match I had with HOOK for [his] debut [match], I come to the back after I lose and Punk immediately comes up to me and says, ‘Hey, I know you’re on the losing end of this, but we’re trying to make a star and you did everything in your power to make that kid tonight and I appreciate you for that.’ It’s hard for me to hate a guy, I wasn’t there in Chicago on All Out night, I don’t know what happened, and I refuse to speculate and I refuse to ask my friends on each side what happened because that’s all about bullsht in the back. I’m worried about growing the wrestling business, being a better wrestler every day. I think a lot of wrestlers get caught up in bullsht and I refuse to in that sense.”

www.fightful.com/wrestling/fuego-del-sol-says-there-no-picking-sides-between-cm-punk-and-elite-back?utm_source=TW-Fightful&utm_medium=Fightful%20Wrestling%20News&utm_campaign=dlvr.it

[Mid-Carder]

Punk has always been good to people who aren't a threat to him. This is nothing new. Not that he's not genuine about helping people, there are many stories about it but his issues have always been with people at his level and higher.

[Dub H]

Jul 31, 2023 10:59:12 GMT -5 HMARK Center said:

Yeah, hate to say it guys, but seeing Punk live at Forbidden Door and Collision, the crowd is very invested in him, whether to cheer or to boo.

I don't personally care that much; I liked his Kojima match a lot, and I get people not liking having Cena flashbacks with "he's acting like a face but getting booed" (or in some cases "he's acting like a heel but getting cheered") stuff or whatever, but he's getting major, very loud reactions and it means they're gonna lean into it.

I'm ok with giving some of it more time, too; Ricky cheating just started, he hasn't done anything so far beyond the pale that it makes him an irredeemable scumbag against noble, saintly Punk, and Punk's gladly leaned into playing heelish since this comeback, too. And anything that doesn't impact on-screen stuff in a negative way is something I can't be arsed to care about at the moment.

Booing doesnt mean invested. If they stay quiet it just makes him seem like he is universally accepted.

Split reactions are not a good thing, never were

[Feargus McReddit]

Jul 31, 2023 14:53:11 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Jul 31, 2023 10:59:12 GMT -5 HMARK Center said:

Yeah, hate to say it guys, but seeing Punk live at Forbidden Door and Collision, the crowd is very invested in him, whether to cheer or to boo.

I don't personally care that much; I liked his Kojima match a lot, and I get people not liking having Cena flashbacks with "he's acting like a face but getting booed" (or in some cases "he's acting like a heel but getting cheered") stuff or whatever, but he's getting major, very loud reactions and it means they're gonna lean into it.

I'm ok with giving some of it more time, too; Ricky cheating just started, he hasn't done anything so far beyond the pale that it makes him an irredeemable scumbag against noble, saintly Punk, and Punk's gladly leaned into playing heelish since this comeback, too. And anything that doesn't impact on-screen stuff in a negative way is something I can't be arsed to care about at the moment.

Booing doesnt mean invested. If they stay quiet it just makes him seem like he is universally accepted.

Split reactions are not a good thing, never were

I mean, they kind of are? Because if people weren’t somewhat invested they wouldn’t react in any way.

Like, far be it from me to take a side but it doesn’t seem like we’re talking about X-Pac heat here.