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Post by HIM on Sept 5, 2023 23:13:24 GMT -5
I think Punk should've been canned after Brawl Out, but yes, 100% with Tony on firing him. It sounds like Perry still has some growing up to do, too, so I think a short suspension is deserved as well. This. It was the right decision, I just think it shouldn't have taken that long before it. Like dude didn't need to speak to a council and almost get into a fight before bringing the hammer down. Still glad that bum was fired tho.
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Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Sept 5, 2023 23:14:41 GMT -5
Just gotta throw it out there, Tony wasn't "forced" to do anything, the answer was obvious.
CM Punk went after Tony, he choked Jungle Boy out
I don't think there was any other situation where Punk was going to survive employment when Khan said he feared for his life. That isn't someone you keep employed. The scrum you could argue in some sense was more ambiguous, this wasn't, and it also didn't involve making a beeline for the boss screaming threats.
People are gonna hang on the "Recommended by a legal council" thing but that shit is the most technical of legal jargon imo, they essentially probably just gave Tony the ok to cut him loose with no legal blowback rather than "Without them, Tony would have just kept Punk employed and pressed on". Honestly Tony saying it was all his decision is probably not the way you wanna go about it if there's legalese in Punk's contract over it. You put that down to other people, even WWE does that with the Head of Talent Relations.
And it's only so much of a "Black eye" as they make it. Inevitably, Punk being gone hasn't changed much of anything as far as the show goes, and it didn't change when he was gone the first time either. I don't think AEW is going to lose anything, except maybe some of the more annoying stans on the planet, in making this decision. You can argue it should have been done sooner, sure, you can argue it was stupid, but a Black Eye is something that does damage to a company that isn't repairable... CM Punk WISHES he could have done that, but at this point? Far as I can see? AEW's gonna be better than ever, especially now that he, the albatross, is gone.
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Post by Cry Me a Wiggle on Sept 5, 2023 23:19:03 GMT -5
It should have never gotten this far... No matter what side you are on it is ultimately an extremely ugly mark on AEW especially coming off what was the biggest wrestling show of all time and this is the continued headline... Tony Khan is ultimately responsible for his business and the lack of awareness and preparation within it and Punk should have never been able to act and react as freely as he was in such a negative manner. I wish we could stop with the generalization stuff of cults, stans, etc though as it just comes off as really antagonizing especially considering none of us fans (no matter what side your on) have a dog in this fight...and is ultimately just in fighting between one fanbase. The vast majority of Punk fans understand that Punk is a total idiot for blowing one of the biggest returns of all time and going in these circles isn't going to help... nor is making this thread or another one a CM Punk catch all thread to continue the fight. Khan has the ROSEBUD infinite money cheat but it still sucks and will forever be a black eye on this company at such an early age... Honestly, far from being a black eye, I’d say that in a wrestling business which has given us Vince McMahon letting Shawn Michaels lose his smile whenever he got a little cranky, Eric Bischoff giving Hulk Hogan creative control and taking leadership advice from his drinking buddies Hall and Nash, Dixie Carter letting her last image of Hulk Hogan in her promotion being her clinging to his leg begging him to stay, and Vince McMahon gift-wrapping his world title to Brock Lesnar to show up and deign to defend whenever he felt like it, this degree of accountability and house-cleaning is legitimately refreshing. Well put. Punk was arguably Tony’s Michaels or Hogan, a comparison made quite a bit over the last year. And while Hogan never got physical or threatened Bischoff, it’s still a massive thing to have the super fan boss fire his favorite wrestler no matter the circumstance. But I’d also argue WCW loyalists were never as primed or excited for Hogan as AEW diehards were for Punk. That debut and nearly everything up to the Hangman feud are still rated highly. Punk was, at one time, worth as much to AEW as his supporters now still claim him to be. So it just goes to show how detailed everything got over the course of one calendar year. Punk lost most of the locker room, then he lost a sizable number of fans, and then he finally lost Tony Khan. And I really doubt he’d have done the latter had he not permanently and irrevocably crossed the line. Dude got more second chances than Richard Nixon, but eventually your crimes get caught on tape and you’ve got to go home to your dog. I’m sure it still wasn’t an easy decision for Tony Khan to make, but he did it and did it with tact and grace, even thanking Punk for his contributions to the company.
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Post by ARI WOW WOW on Sept 6, 2023 0:21:31 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better.
I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to.
It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows.
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Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Sept 6, 2023 0:35:33 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better. I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to. It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows. The catalyst to the drama was actually CM Punk, and very majorly because of CM Punk. He himself caused the drama when he went after a guy at the scrum who he THOUGHT was good friends with Colt Cabana, and even when Punk found out he wasn't, he ranted about Cabana, and then shit on The Elite to follow it and said "IF YOU DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT, THEN COME FIND ME" Colt Cabana also wasn't fired by the way, he was going to be, The Bucks (AND OTHERS) stopped it from happening because Colt is a beloved backstage presence for everyone but one very specific man. That wasn't the reason they "turned" on him either, saying they were dumb f***s who couldn't manage a Target in a public setting I think was the point of no return, as it should be for many people. Nothing about the situation was triggered by The Elite to this extreme of a level. It was started by Punk, there is literal video evidence that shows it was started by CM Punk, and he is the one who set every single domino in motion to what caused "Brawl Out", and then he and his buddies made THAT even worse too Jungle Boy saying "Cry me a river" yes, was on him, but you cannot hold Jack Perry accountable for CM Punk's aggressive confrontation, assault, and then trying to attack the boss of the company off of a statement, that too is on CM Punk in the way he handled it. Also "It won't be the last backstage fight" lmfao and you know this how? Like acting like this is an extremely common thing, the only other incident we ever had to an extreme level was Andrade and Sammy, both of whom have not gotten into any serious issues for well over a years time. Firing the guy responsible for two major backstage confrontations seems like a pretty smart and professional way to make sure that there's a very low risk of it ever happening again.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Sept 6, 2023 0:45:15 GMT -5
Honestly, far from being a black eye, I’d say that in a wrestling business which has given us Vince McMahon letting Shawn Michaels lose his smile whenever he got a little cranky, Eric Bischoff giving Hulk Hogan creative control and taking leadership advice from his drinking buddies Hall and Nash, Dixie Carter letting her last image of Hulk Hogan in her promotion being her clinging to his leg begging him to stay, and Vince McMahon gift-wrapping his world title to Brock Lesnar to show up and deign to defend whenever he felt like it, this degree of accountability and house-cleaning is legitimately refreshing. Well put. Punk was arguably Tony’s Michaels or Hogan, a comparison made quite a bit over the last year. And while Hogan never got physical or threatened Bischoff, it’s still a massive thing to have the super fan boss fire his favorite wrestler no matter the circumstance. But I’d also argue WCW loyalists were never as primed or excited for Hogan as AEW diehards were for Punk. That debut and nearly everything up to the Hangman feud are still rated highly. Punk was, at one time, worth as much to AEW as his supporters now still claim him to be. So it just goes to show how detailed everything got over the course of one calendar year. Punk lost most of the locker room, then he lost a sizable number of fans, and then he finally lost Tony Khan. And I really doubt he’d have done the latter had he not permanently and irrevocably crossed the line. Dude got more second chances than Richard Nixon, but eventually your crimes get caught on tape and you’ve got to go home to your dog. I’m sure it still wasn’t an easy decision for Tony Khan to make, but he did it and did it with tact and grace, even thanking Punk for his contributions to the company. Tony gave him a second chance and clearly it f***ing bombed as a second chance because the only thing Punk ended up selling in the end were t-shirts given the funky way the PPV schedule landed around his return. We can debate whether that second chance was justified or not. But I do think there's a case to be made that the legal red tape Tony is rumoured to have put around Punk's return and then the swift booting of him when he pulled that shit again does give me a lot of hope for Tony and for the future of AEW. Punk had a shorter time calling shots and f***ing with ugly politics than WCW Hogan, '90s Shawn, and hell even TNA Hogan. They definitely aren't comparable given that none of those guys ever threatened their bosses' safety the way Punk did, but it does stand out to me as worth noting that Tony pulled the trigger on discipline a whole hell of a lot faster than the "never" we saw from Dixie and Bischoff over Hogan, or Vince over Shawn. This whole nightmare is a learning experience for Tony, the kind of thing that he can't just look at past wrestling history and have a clear-cut answer for. And I hope that lesson isn't to go "no more second chances", because you can compare it to the around-the-same-time fight of Eddie and Sammy who got heated but both did their time, and have come back free of problems since and returned into regular rotation as featured and behaved stars on the wrestleshow. But there's clearly a lot of personal junk tied up in it and clearly a lot of fannish hope it was going to work out. It's worth pointing out the ways Tony f***ed it up, but it's also in my mind worth giving him credit for doing what needed to be done against a backdrop of wrestling history where a lot of people in his position didn't. AEW's future can be brighter if this knocked some dumb ideas out of his head and he accepts more responsibility for the tone of his locker room and the way these issues are handled.
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Post by Non Banjoble Tokens on Sept 6, 2023 2:07:51 GMT -5
I don't agree with it.
I really feel like CM Punk should have been locked inside a crate and shipped off to that warehouse that holds the Ark of the Covenant.
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Nosnorb
El Dandy
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Post by Nosnorb on Sept 6, 2023 4:33:17 GMT -5
I have no idea how anyone can say that Tony didn't make the right decision by shitcanning CM Punk.
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Post by The Legendary Ring Troll {BLM} on Sept 6, 2023 7:57:08 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better. I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to. It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows. Hangman and the Bucks? For being the catalyst? This shits embarrassing at this point and the likes on your comment aren’t surprising.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Sept 6, 2023 8:03:25 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better. I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to. It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows. Hangman and the Bucks? For being the catalyst? This shits embarrassing at this point and the likes on your comment aren’t surprising. Punk: The Elite Spread news about Cabana. Elite Haters/ Punk Fans: Omg ,basically truth.
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markymark
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,381
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Post by markymark on Sept 6, 2023 8:21:51 GMT -5
Good thng at the end TK sided with the Elite.
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Post by SneakMan on Sept 6, 2023 8:22:36 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better. I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to. It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows. I mean you could do that but you'd be wrong. Punk was the catalyst for all this simply because he's unable to let shit go. He's had a long history predating AEW of holding grudges and this time it cost him his job. And whatever shots the Elite took against Punk (by my count it's 2 public shots vs Punk's 4), in no way did any of them justify Punk literally assaulting people, including his boss.
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Allie Kitsune
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Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Sept 6, 2023 9:39:10 GMT -5
It honestly shocks me that here of all places there's anybody who thinks assault is a justified reaction to non-violent action.
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Post by The anti-ratings Luddite on Sept 6, 2023 10:02:35 GMT -5
I'd hold Punk accountable for his violent outburst at Wembley, but I'd also hold Hangman, the Bucks and Perry accountable for being the catalyst to the whole drama, and TK for not handling it all better. I can understand Punk, he came to all ELITE wrestling to work with these guys, and then those guys basically turned on him due to Cabana firing. Since then, stuff has been piling over on him and it all led to what it led to. It wasn't the first backstage brawl and this wont be last. People should study the whole journey of how we got to this point, from different perspectives. The guy who signs the checks should learn to make his locker room more professional and make them follow his word and vision. And if he can't then keep the roster of just friends together and let them run the shows.
I'm not going to immediately dismiss you, I'm instead just going to ask: What is it, exactly, that Hangman Adam Page did?
Maybe I just missed something in this whole drama from about a year ago when the whole Page/Punk match and post match nonsense happened, but Hangman said a line that seemed perfectly within kayfabe in a promo, Punk got mad about it, and then after winning the title attempted to bury him 6 feet deep.
That's how I interpreted those events, but I'm dying to hear another perspective because otherwise the argument really does just seem like "I like CM Punk more than I like The Elite and I'm going to attempt to counterbalance the actual evidence against CM Punk with hearsay and assumptions about The Elite"
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 73,747
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Post by Chiral on Sept 6, 2023 12:14:15 GMT -5
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Post by firsttimelongtime on Sept 6, 2023 12:33:50 GMT -5
Punk deserved to be fired. I see a lot of straw men being built about Punk supporters who think he shouldn’t have been. Yet none of those people post here. Yet they are constantly referenced. Strange.
What’s stranger is people still acting as if there are real life baby faces and heels in this dispute among two opposing groups of people. Both people feel justified in things that happened. Both feel slighted by the other for things none of us can understand. It’s a complex situation that should result in complex feelings.
What isn’t complex is Punk supposedly threatening and (at least) lunging at his boss. He deserved to be fired there.
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Kalmia
King Koopa
Happy to be here
Posts: 11,707
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Post by Kalmia on Sept 6, 2023 12:34:06 GMT -5
Well, I'm convinced. I'm changing my vote to No.
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Sept 6, 2023 12:50:01 GMT -5
Good thng at the end TK sided with the Elite.
Dude really thought he was gonna run the Elite off and he’d have the company to himself looool
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Post by polarbearpete on Sept 6, 2023 12:50:05 GMT -5
Honestly, far from being a black eye, I’d say that in a wrestling business which has given us Vince McMahon letting Shawn Michaels lose his smile whenever he got a little cranky, Eric Bischoff giving Hulk Hogan creative control and taking leadership advice from his drinking buddies Hall and Nash, Dixie Carter letting her last image of Hulk Hogan in her promotion being her clinging to his leg begging him to stay, and Vince McMahon gift-wrapping his world title to Brock Lesnar to show up and deign to defend whenever he felt like it, this degree of accountability and house-cleaning is legitimately refreshing. In my opinion it would be great if it felt genuine and preventative action was taken but it took him being forced before standing up for himself and his company...He said so himself. To be fair, the wording Khan used definitely seemed like it was prepared for him by legal counsel in order to make it look like he had no alternative and to further buttress their “for cause” argument should this go to litigation. I think the decision was ultimately Khan’s though, he wasn’t “forced” into anything. It’s a private company that he owns, he can do anything that he wants as long as it’s lawful.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Sept 6, 2023 12:56:26 GMT -5
Yeah, "legal counsel advised me to fire him," is 100% TK covering his ass in case Punk tries to sue. Ultimately the decision was his.
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