Impact Rating Plummets Due To RAW.

[Arturo Classico]

Gauntlet (although reall a battle royal) was way better than anything thing on raw this week. Plus it builds to a great main event at Destination X. While build to a forgettable one at No Way Out. Lethal skit was hilarious. Angle vs Steiner seeds were planted. So again much better than Raw.

[Corporate H]

Well this should shut up the TNA marks...atleast for a little while.

TNA isn't ready for the WWE yet, sorry guys.

[hollywood]

csm126 said:

kingsofwrestling said:

I watched Impact. I was way more entertained by Impact than I was by Raw which has two hours and accomplishes nothing.

And iMPACT did accomplish something?

Of course it did. It successfully drove half of its viewers to RAW.

[Can you afford to pay me, Gah]

I think it somewhat TNA fault on this. Not really because the WWE. First off they had two hours on Monday and what did they do with that two hours? They should PPV matches for last year on it and count down TNA moments. Now what if they did a special live two hours Show called "This is TNA on that Monday? They hyped that instead of what they did. I bet that would drawn better numbers. Then what if they end it with something not sure what but they could go off air with the anouncers saying something like "Tune in Thursday at our normal time to see what happens, Were out of time, we Gotta go!!! Then cut.

It could be like Christian and Samoa Joe in a stand off. Just when they were about to fight it cuts. Making fans wonder what happens. Then the Thursday Impact which they could taped that day or night. They hype and show the off air footage of the brawl.

[mysterydriver]

...Ow.

It isn't shocking....but ow.

By the way, people discussing YouTube shooters...they will most likely whine and call people stupid for watching Raw.

[HMARK Center]

I can't really think of anyone with a serious opinion who didn't see this coming.

TNA ain't an established brand, folks, and it doesn't have anywhere near the amount of money some people think it does (just being profitable doesn't make you rich). It's gonna be quite awhile before they can do anything resembling head-to-head with WWE on a consistent basis.

[REDUNBECK~!]

kingsofwrestling said:

Gauntlet (although reall a battle royal) was way better than anything thing on raw this week. Plus it builds to a great main event at Destination X. While build to a forgettable one at No Way Out. Lethal skit was hilarious. Angle vs Steiner seeds were planted. So again much better than Raw.

Okay, ya got me on the gauntlet. They got themselves a number one contender.

Angle vs. Steiner. Eh, they also planted seeds of Steiner vs. Tomko. We might get Steiner vs. Angle vs. Tomko in a horrific three-way. But we'll have to wait and see.

But Jay Lethal? So what if he was funny? It was a nothing, pointless skit that will almost assuredly lead to Jay Lethal being humiliated in another wacky skit. What's the point of that? TNA likes to complain that they have so little time to do anything on the show. The Jay Lethal/PCS Idol skit was the perfect example of shit that TNA needs to cut from the line-up to maximize their match time. Why waste any of your precious screen-time on a skit that's not building up a PPV (your main source of revenue)? Why not just cut the pointless stuff and have more wrestling and PPV hype videos/promos?

And if the answer is "we have nothing else for those lower-rank X-Division guys and Kevin Nash to do"...then why don't you just leave them off the show? No one will miss them all that much. Practically every TNA PPV has some kind of X-Division spot fest that those guys get to pop up in, and any fan who's been buying PPVs for any length of time knows it. All you have to do is say "And remember folks, we're also having an X-Division exhibition!" during your PPV hype. It'll work. Maybe the occasional "History of the X-Division" video piece. But that's all you need. You don't need guys like Jay Lethal or Sonjay Dutt going to Kevin Nash for gimmick advice in the middle of iMPACT every week because that shit never goes anywhere.

[Arturo Classico]

I feel it will eventually. Because to be honest Dutt and Lethal need gimmicks to get over other than what they are doing because we all know if a great gimmick Lethal could be a star. Thats what they developing. It just takes time to build people up. Also we don't need X-Division exhibitions. That did not make the X-Division better. Look at what WWE is doing with Cruiserweight title thats what TNA did with the X-Division. Feuds makes a title better not god damn exhibitions. The World X Cup is great but other than that it's pointless.

[REDUNBECK~!]

kingsofwrestling said:

I feel it will eventually. Because to be honest Dutt and Lethal need gimmicks to get over other than what they are doing because we all know if a great gimmick Lethal could be a star. Thats what they developing. It just takes time to build people up. Also we don't need X-Division exhibitions. That did not make the X-Division better. Look at what WWE is doing with Cruiserweight title thats what TNA did with the X-Division. Feuds makes a title better not god damn exhibitions. The World X Cup is great but other than that it's pointless.

Why does Jay Lethal need a gimmick to be a star? Is his in-ring ability not good enough to make him popular? I think it is good enough! When he gets going he's damn fun to watch. People like wrestlers who have fun matches.

X-Division exhibitions would be a totally good thing. If TNA had cut the PCS Idol bit and instead aired a "X-Division Highlights" package with all the big moments from X-Division history and then Tenay and West said "And remember folks, those amazing X-Division athletes will be in action at our PPV!", I guarantee you that a good number of people who weren't planning on buying the PPV would change their minds to see those guys. The X-Division is cool because it's a unique segment of the wrestling business, and that uniqueness makes it a special attraction.

At this point I question the need for an X-Division title. Is that belt intriguing viewers to watch? I doubt it. You could have some X-Division feuds, sure, but not every X-Division guy needs to be in a feud or have a gimmick all the time. It just makes for too much stuff to keep up with.

As for the World X Cup...if it's great why does it need anything else? The idea is to achieve greatness. The World X Cup has reached it's goal and if properly advertised it'll always draw some buys. Maybe not a majority, but any buys drawn is a good reason to keep it.

[Can you afford to pay me, Gah]

^^^ Good point. I mean look at the Crusierweight title, I'm not taking nothing away from Gregery Helms as a wrestler because he is good. But honestly, with all this so called "history" he making from the WWE stand point. Now look back on Smackdown in that year. Of course he making history because for the longest time he wasn't even booked. Then half of the challengers have been released or moved to another brand.

At less in TNA the X title does have a meaning and TNA always had the belt on the line every PPV and the champion is seen weekly. How many Smackdown or cross brands shows have done down were Gregery Helms wasn't even booked or defending the title? A bunch.

Look at the remaining Crusierweights on Smackdown. You got

Jamie Knoble? Nobody knows were he been.
Scotty Too Hotty? Who gives a crap
Jimmy Wang Yang: Talented but whatever
Funaki: Same as Knoble
Shannon Moore: Yea bring in an ECW guy to fill in a spot.

The sad thing is three of there over all best are not even near it. Super Crazy for whatever dumb reason is on raw. London and Kendrick are all about Tag team wrestling.

At less in TNA the X title as been futured in a PPV main event. right now there at less a feud with the title with Sabin and Lynn for the last couple of months.

[Arturo Classico]

csm126 said:

kingsofwrestling said:

I feel it will eventually. Because to be honest Dutt and Lethal need gimmicks to get over other than what they are doing because we all know if a great gimmick Lethal could be a star. Thats what they developing. It just takes time to build people up. Also we don't need X-Division exhibitions. That did not make the X-Division better. Look at what WWE is doing with Cruiserweight title thats what TNA did with the X-Division. Feuds makes a title better not god damn exhibitions. The World X Cup is great but other than that it's pointless.

Why does Jay Lethal need a gimmick to be a star? Is his in-ring ability not good enough to make him popular? I think it is good enough! When he gets going he's damn fun to watch. People like wrestlers who have fun matches.

X-Division exhibitions would be a totally good thing. If TNA had cut the PCS Idol bit and instead aired a "X-Division Highlights" package with all the big moments from X-Division history and then Tenay and West said "And remember folks, those amazing X-Division athletes will be in action at out PPV!", I guarantee you that a good number of people who weren't planning on buying the PPV would change their minds to see those guys. The X-Division is cool because it's a unique segment of the wrestling business, and that uniqueness makes it a special attraction.

At this point I question the need for an X-Division title. Is that belt intriguing viewers to watch? I doubt it. You could have some X-Division feuds, sure, but not every X-Division guy needs to be in a feud or have a gimmick all the time. It just makes for too much stuff to keep up with.

As for the World X Cup...if it's great why does it need anything else? The idea is to achieve greatness. The World X Cup has reached it's goal and if properly advertised it'll always draw some buys. Maybe not a majority, but any buys drawn is a good reason to keep it.

I said the World X-Cup was great it should stay I love that I said it was fine(sorry about that I said it should stay but the other exhibitions that don't continue a storyline should be scapped). Exhibitions are waste since yeah I admit I enjoyed them but they are just filler, thats it I don't think filler should be on a ppv and I admit Against All Odds had to much of that and to me that have to stop that, and just do I don't important matches that further storylines.

As for Lethal you have to remember what works as an idie does not work nationally. Lethal can be Letahl in JAPW or when he was in ROH. But to make it (if your name isn't Finlay, Benoit or Angle) is that you have to have some sort of gimmick for the casual fans to care about you. I'm not saying he should do a Macho Man gimmick. He should go a gimmick that is an overexaggerated version of his persoanlity, those are the best. But he does need a gimmick because him and Dutt seem bland outside of the ring and that is not good the PCS segments are slowly giving them some sort of personality.

[REDUNBECK~!]

steinerecliner said:

^^^ Good point. I mean look at the Crusierweight title, I'm not taking nothing away from Gregery Helms as a wrestler because he is good. But honestly, with all this so called "history" he making from the WWE stand point. Now look back on Smackdown in that year. Of course he making history because for the longest time he wasn't even booked. Then half of the challengers have been released or moved to another brand.

At less in TNA the X title does have a meaning and TNA always had the belt on the line every PPV and the champion is seen weekly. How many Smackdown or cross brands shows have done down were Gregery Helms wasn't even booked or defending the title? A bunch.

Look at the remaining Crusierweights on Smackdown. You got

Jamie Knoble? Nobody knows were he been.
Scotty Too Hotty? Who gives a crap
Jimmy Wang Yang: Talented but whatever
Funaki: Same as Knoble
Shannon Moore: Yea bring in an ECW guy to fill in a spot.

The sad thing is three of there over all best are not even near it. Super Crazy for whatever dumb reason is on raw. London and Kendrick are all about Tag team wrestling.

At less in TNA the X title as been futured in a PPV main event. right now there at less a feud with the title with Sabin and Lynn for the last couple of months.

I agree that the Cruiserweight belt is pointless now. I'd scrap it to be honest because no one cares about it. And if WWE could learn to book the crusierweights right they'd have something great on their hands.

But does the X title mean all that much? Sabin and Lynn are feuding because Sabin called Lynn old. They're fighting over respect. I haven't even heard Jerry Lynn say a darn thing about wanting the belt (maybe I missed something? a promo perhaps?).

And as for the X champ being seen weekly. Yeah, so? He's seen. Bob Backlund is seen weekly and he doesn't mean jack shit. Leticia is seen weekly, and she doesn't mean anything. So Cal Val is seen weekly and we still don't know what her purpose is in this company. Being seen doesn't mean much. Hell, being seen less can be a good thing sometimes.

Look at Undertaker. He does a feud and then what? He takes MONTHS off. He goes unseen for a while. When he comes back, it's a big deal, because he only shows up to have big feuds. Now I'm not saying the X Champ needs to take months off, but he doesn't need to be on every week. It's not like giving him a week or two off will hurt him or the belt.

[Person With A Hat]

aodpilot said:

Let's be honest, who DIDN'T see this coming?

I didn't.

I thought it'd be much lower.

[REDUNBECK~!]

kingsofwrestling said:

I said the World X-Cup was great it should stay I love that I said it was fine(sorry about that I said it should stay but the other exhibitions that don't continue a storyline should be scapped). Exhibitions are waste since yeah I admit I enjoyed them but they are just filler, thats it I don't think filler should be on a ppv and I admit Against All Odds had to much of that and to me that have to stop that, and just do I don't important matches that further storylines.

Last time I checked, PPV matches were supposed to end storylines, not further them. TNA can't seem to grasp that very well (see: Sting vs. Chris Abyss)

As for Lethal you have to remember what works as an idie does not work nationally. Lethal can be Letahl in JAPW or when he was in ROH. But to make it (if your name isn't Finlay, Benoit or Angle) is that you have to have some sort of gimmick for the casual fans to care about you. I'm not saying he should do a Macho Man gimmick. He should go a gimmick that is an overexaggerated version of his persoanlity, those are the best. But he does need a gimmick because him and Dutt seem bland outside of the ring and that is not good the PCS segments are slowly giving them some sort of personality.

Who cares if Lethal is bland outside the ring? We don't need to see him outside the ring. Why can't his gimmick be that he's a good wrestler? A radical idea, I know, but just crazy enough to work.

And look, no matter how much of a gimmick Lethal gets, he ain't ever gonna mean squat to casual fans. Casual fans only pay close attention to the main event because the main event has the names they know. The BIG names. Jay Lethal isn't a big name and never will be. Do you think casual fans care about Norman Smiley? Nah. And that's why Norman doesn't have a gimmick other than that he wrestles.

I hate to break it to you, but not everyone on the roster needs to get over. It's not necessary. In fact, it's a downright nonsensical notion. You can't get everyone over, because if EVERYONE is a star then there are no stars. The stars are the guys who are bigger and better. And you can't be bigger and better unless there are people who are less significant than you. The fans see the following men as the stars in TNA:

Samoa Joe, Kurt Angle, Christian Cage, Scott Steiner, Sting, Abyss

Those are the ONLY men who need to be put over on a weekly basis. Everyone else needs to get by on their in-ring ability. If you devote time to putting over people the fans just don't care about, you're wasting your time because it ain't gonna work. Just focus on getting the stars over. You don't need to make new stars until your current stars are on their way out. And your new stars will be guys the fans have taken a liking too based on wrestling ability. Once the fans like a guy's work, then try giving him a gimmick. Don't give him a gimmick first and hope his wrestling will be accepted later on.

[Rick Mad]

csm126 said:

kingsofwrestling said:

I said the World X-Cup was great it should stay I love that I said it was fine(sorry about that I said it should stay but the other exhibitions that don't continue a storyline should be scapped). Exhibitions are waste since yeah I admit I enjoyed them but they are just filler, thats it I don't think filler should be on a ppv and I admit Against All Odds had to much of that and to me that have to stop that, and just do I don't important matches that further storylines.

Last time I checked, PPV matches were supposed to end storylines, not further them. TNA can't seem to grasp that very well (see: Sting vs. Chris Abyss)

Maybe PPV matches were supposed to do that when they only do one every two or three months or something, but nowadays PPVs are definitely used to further storylines in pretty much every company that does them.

[HMARK Center]

Last time I checked, PPV matches were supposed to end storylines, not further them. TNA can't seem to grasp that very well (see: Sting vs. Chris Abyss)

That really isn't feasible. There are too many PPV's these days, for one thing; ending a feud after one match would be a booking nightmare, since now you'd need a whole new match/storyline set up for one month later.

Also, TNA gets a maximum of about 4 hours a month to build to each PPV. Hard to get very fleshed out storylines in four hours, no?

[Kevin Hamilton]

Today's company is episodic in nature anyway. So you don't really necessarily 'end' any storyline.

[Arturo Classico]

Exactly that is why a Two hour show would benefit them alot. Than it would give the 8 hours a month which is what you really need to prperly build for a PPV. Although Smackdown did not use that time well as it seems.

[REDUNBECK~!]

jackrabbitslim said:

Today's company is episodic in nature anyway. So you don't really necessarily 'end' any storyline.

Well that's kind of a problem, eh? Stories are supposed to end. That's a problem TNA has; they can't write a story properly. Some of their stories have beginnings and middles but no ends, some have middles and ends but no beginnings, and some just end without a beginning or middle.

[REDUNBECK~!]

kingsofwrestling said:

Exactly that is why a Two hour show would benefit them alot. Than it would give the 8 hours a month which is what you really need to prperly build for a PPV. Although Smackdown did not use that time well as it seems.

You don't need 8 hours to build a PPV well. And complaining that they need more time isn't going to change anything, because they ain't gonna get more time until they can work with the time they have. If TNA wants more time, they need to take their 4 hours a month and streamline them to make them effective ratings and PPV draws. If they do that they'll impress Spike and have leverage when they ask for more time.

But right now, TNA has 4 hours, which, when you factor out commercials, is actually less than 3 hours. Well, roughly 2.5 of those 3 hours are squandered on stupid, useless skits. Maybe more than that. How much wrestling was there on the iMPACT before last? Like 6 minutes by some counts. Spike looks at TNA, sees them wasting time, and they decide not to give TNA more time because they have no reason to believe TNA wouldn't just waste the added time.