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Post by derangedhermit on Jun 8, 2010 14:40:18 GMT -5
I think this particular group of guys works better as a gang than the crop of rookies on Season 2. Could you imagine Percy Watson kicking your ass while laughing like he does? www.oldspice.com/videos/all/28/Flex_30/Building kick!
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Raul
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,183
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Post by Raul on Jun 8, 2010 14:40:19 GMT -5
You know what? I just have some feeling this might happen. The NXT 1 vs WWE, or NXT 1 vs NXT 2 will happen in a War Games match. Now either of those would be the s***.
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Post by Brian Suntan on Jun 8, 2010 14:40:34 GMT -5
I've a nagging doubt this angle won't last long, it'll just be some game Vince is playing with Bret, but what do I know? It was fun. That would suck so much. They have such a huge chance here to make something out of a good storyline. Yet considering their track record the last few years WWE has really botched good storylines. Remember Vince's illegitimate son? Regal as GM Of RAW? Legacy? Lets hope they keep this going one going at least to Summerslam. I could see a big team main event for Summerslam. Or if they wanted to they could even go as far as Survivor Series. I agree, that's just the feeling I get. Ideally it will be exposed as Vince's plan, and then they go rogue and give him a beat down. Like I said, I don't know. It could go either way. Maybe this is why they're bringing back the Survivor Series? War Games is another thought. Maybe have that at the SS.
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Post by Iceking251980A on Jun 8, 2010 14:41:07 GMT -5
wished they would've dragged Vince out and beat him down, i could hear Bryan"this is for talking in Cole's ear and tell him to rag on me"
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2010 14:44:06 GMT -5
No, I'm saying it won't work long-term because they don't have any name value. I edited my earlier post to eliminate Hogan (he's too big of a star) and just focus on Hall and Nash. Those two had name value and credibility. Sting (for example) was going to sell for them and it would be realistic. Who is going to buy any of these guys wrestling WWE stars? Again, if TNA guys showed up, it would have been better since they at least have some mainstream exposure. Believe them wrestling WWE stars? This isn't 'Tough Enough'! Some of these guys have been wrestling for years, not weeks and given the right opportunity, are probably a damn sight better than some of the ''stars'' WWE have currently employed. At the end of the day, they are a bunch of guys looking to MAKE their name. They might have established indy experience, but what good is that going to do for a WWE fanbase that has little to no exposure to that? To a normal WWE fan those guys are "those rookies from NXT". When Hall and Nash showed up in WCW, it was "holy shit, it's Razor and Diesel invading!". It is name value that took the nWo to great heights, and it is lack of name value that will ultimately stunt this angle, IMO. I'll put it another way, if Buff Bagwell, Scott Norton, Vincent, Fake Sting, and Konnan were the invaders back in 1996 (instead of Hall, Nash, and Hogan), that angle would have lasted 10 seconds regardless of how well it was booked. Who is going to buy one of the NXT guys against Cena? Or HHH? Or Undertaker? Or Orton? That's all I am saying. It worked last night, but long-term, having a bunch of guys who are relatively new to the mainstream audience do this type of angle has very little lasting power because the fans already know that Cena (or whoever) will wipe them out. There is a reason why the fans were shocked rather than throwing crap in the ring and booing hardcore. They have no emotional investment in those guys and it was shocking to see them dominate like that.
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Post by Azrael from Outerspace on Jun 8, 2010 14:51:05 GMT -5
Believe them wrestling WWE stars? This isn't 'Tough Enough'! Some of these guys have been wrestling for years, not weeks and given the right opportunity, are probably a damn sight better than some of the ''stars'' WWE have currently employed. At the end of the day, they are a bunch of guys looking to MAKE their name. They might have established indy experience, but what good is that going to do for a WWE fanbase that has little to no exposure to that? To a normal WWE fan those guys are "those rookies from NXT". When Hall and Nash showed up in WCW, it was "holy s***, it's Razor and Diesel invading!". It is name value that took the nWo to great heights, and it is lack of name value that will ultimately stunt this angle, IMO. I'll put it another way, if Buff Bagwell, Scott Norton, Vincent, Fake Sting, and Konnan were the invaders back in 1996 (instead of Hall, Nash, and Hogan), that angle would have lasted 10 seconds regardless of how well it was booked. Who is going to buy one of the NXT guys against Cena? Or HHH? Or Undertaker? Or Orton? That's all I am saying. It worked last night, but long-term, having a bunch of guys who are relatively new to the mainstream audience do this type of angle has very little lasting power because the fans already know that Cena (or whoever) will wipe them out. There is a reason why the fans were shocked rather than throwing crap in the ring and booing hardcore. They have no emotional investment in those guys and it was shocking to see them dominate like that. How do you figure? This doesn't come down to name power because if AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Davey Richards and KENTA invaded they would be in the same position. It comes down to booking and that is all. If creative over the next month books them to be some unstoppable, unrelenting machine the fans will buy it. This is evident by how many people on here loved it along with reports of the fans at the arena buzzing about it. If creative has them lose and look weak then they will not get over. Fans are begging for something different from what they get. This could easily be it and most of us will go with it...as long as it's booked right. This isn't 1996 where somebody showing up is surprising. We'd know they were coming in 2 months in advance, they'd show up, do the same thing and we'd be like...awesome! Not because it's TNA invaders but because of the booking of said TNA invaders.
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Johnny Flamingo
Hank Scorpio
Killing the business one post at a time
Posts: 6,505
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Post by Johnny Flamingo on Jun 8, 2010 14:55:13 GMT -5
They might have established indy experience, but what good is that going to do for a WWE fanbase that has little to no exposure to that? To a normal WWE fan those guys are "those rookies from NXT". When Hall and Nash showed up in WCW, it was "holy s***, it's Razor and Diesel invading!". It is name value that took the nWo to great heights, and it is lack of name value that will ultimately stunt this angle, IMO. I'll put it another way, if Buff Bagwell, Scott Norton, Vincent, Fake Sting, and Konnan were the invaders back in 1996 (instead of Hall, Nash, and Hogan), that angle would have lasted 10 seconds regardless of how well it was booked. Who is going to buy one of the NXT guys against Cena? Or HHH? Or Undertaker? Or Orton? That's all I am saying. It worked last night, but long-term, having a bunch of guys who are relatively new to the mainstream audience do this type of angle has very little lasting power because the fans already know that Cena (or whoever) will wipe them out. There is a reason why the fans were shocked rather than throwing crap in the ring and booing hardcore. They have no emotional investment in those guys and it was shocking to see them dominate like that. How do you figure? This doesn't come down to name power because if AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Davey Richards and KENTA invaded they would be in the same position. It comes down to booking and that is all. If creative over the next month books them to be some unstoppable, unrelenting machine the fans will buy it. This is evident by how many people on here loved it along with reports of the fans at the arena buzzing about it. If creative has them lose and look weak then they will not get over. Fans are begging for something different from what they get. This could easily be it and most of us will go with it...as long as it's booked right. This isn't 1996 where somebody showing up is surprising. We'd know they were coming in 2 months in advance, they'd show up, do the same thing and we'd be like...awesome! Not because it's TNA invaders but because of the booking of said TNA invaders. Gotta agree with this. Booking, not name power, will make this angle. If anything have the rookies do this makes it batter as we don't know them and thus, don't know what kind of destruction they can really cause. But, after last night, we know that they will destroy any and everything in their path. I'll also say that the crowd reaction to the segment was probably the best reaction I've seen in a long long time.
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Post by Dave the Dave on Jun 8, 2010 14:55:37 GMT -5
I've seen it referenced, but what did Tarver mess up when Bryan was kicking Cena?
THis was just so great. I was still thinking about RAW past 11:30, that rarely happens.
All of them were just so into being evil. Gabriel might be some doubt though. Everyone said he looked evil, but it could have been taken as pensive too. There are so many places to go. Last night Tarver looked so badass, like I've said for weeks.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2010 15:01:30 GMT -5
How do you figure? This doesn't come down to name power because if AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Davey Richards and KENTA invaded they would be in the same position. It comes down to booking and that is all. If creative over the next month books them to be some unstoppable, unrelenting machine the fans will buy it. This is evident by how many people on here loved it along with reports of the fans at the arena buzzing about it. If creative has them lose and look weak then they will not get over. Fans are begging for something different from what they get. This could easily be it and most of us will go with it...as long as it's booked right. This isn't 1996 where somebody showing up is surprising. We'd know they were coming in 2 months in advance, they'd show up, do the same thing and we'd be like...awesome! Not because it's TNA invaders but because of the booking of said TNA invaders. Booking, not name power, will make this angle. This is a great quote - it pretty much sums up why I think TNA still can't figure out how to do something with the "un-established" wrestlers like the X-Division guys who never really get a chance to excel. Names don't make a company - proper booking does.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2010 15:02:49 GMT -5
They might have established indy experience, but what good is that going to do for a WWE fanbase that has little to no exposure to that? To a normal WWE fan those guys are "those rookies from NXT". When Hall and Nash showed up in WCW, it was "holy s***, it's Razor and Diesel invading!". It is name value that took the nWo to great heights, and it is lack of name value that will ultimately stunt this angle, IMO. I'll put it another way, if Buff Bagwell, Scott Norton, Vincent, Fake Sting, and Konnan were the invaders back in 1996 (instead of Hall, Nash, and Hogan), that angle would have lasted 10 seconds regardless of how well it was booked. Who is going to buy one of the NXT guys against Cena? Or HHH? Or Undertaker? Or Orton? That's all I am saying. It worked last night, but long-term, having a bunch of guys who are relatively new to the mainstream audience do this type of angle has very little lasting power because the fans already know that Cena (or whoever) will wipe them out. There is a reason why the fans were shocked rather than throwing crap in the ring and booing hardcore. They have no emotional investment in those guys and it was shocking to see them dominate like that. How do you figure? This doesn't come down to name power because if AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Davey Richards and KENTA invaded they would be in the same position. It comes down to booking and that is all. If creative over the next month books them to be some unstoppable, unrelenting machine the fans will buy it. This is evident by how many people on here loved it along with reports of the fans at the arena buzzing about it. If creative has them lose and look weak then they will not get over. Fans are begging for something different from what they get. This could easily be it and most of us will go with it...as long as it's booked right. This isn't 1996 where somebody showing up is surprising. We'd know they were coming in 2 months in advance, they'd show up, do the same thing and we'd be like...awesome! Not because it's TNA invaders but because of the booking of said TNA invaders. Hey, I like hostile takeover/mass chaos angles when done right, and last night was pretty good. Again, all I am saying is when you deal with characters that the audience doesn't really know too well, and thrust them into stretcher angles with a top babyface, it is going to be hard to sustain moving forward because that is not enough of an establishing to make them credible. Daniel Bryan spit on Cena and kicked him. Ok, but is anyone going to look at him as a legit threat if they faced 1-on-1? TNA gets 1 to 2 million viewers every week. Fans would probably have some clue who Joe and Styles were, even if they were not avid TNA watchers (although a good percentage would have no clue either). In that case it would be simple. Have Joe come out, he'd be recognizable to the percentage that know of him, and he'll be easy to build up to the ones that aren't familiar with him. If NO ONE was familiar with him, then it would be damn difficult to put a Joe/Cena match and have people give a crap about it. That is the scenario I see with this angle, where they climaxed too early and won't have anywhere to go from here. Again, I am not an avid WWE fan, just watched the YouTube clip because of the buzz here so I could be wrong. Unless Vince is the "higher power" in this angle, it'll be hard to sell the fans on those guys being legit threats to the WWE's top stars.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2010 15:08:50 GMT -5
Booking, not name power, will make this angle. This is a great quote - it pretty much sums up why I think TNA still can't figure out how to do something with the "un-established" wrestlers like the X-Division guys who never really get a chance to excel. Names don't make a company - proper booking does. That is a good point, but in the case of a hostile takeover angle, wouldn't the fans have to view the invaders as threats in order to take the storyline itself seriously? Maybe one beatdown last night was enough for fans to take the NXT guys seriously, who knows, but in this case having those guys align with an established guy is probably the best way to go.
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Post by Iceking251980A on Jun 8, 2010 15:20:33 GMT -5
Hopefully Vince is not revealed as the leader, just don't want to see it. Would Jericho work as the leader?
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Post by Iceking251980A on Jun 8, 2010 15:24:51 GMT -5
I'll throw something else out there would it work if the NXT guys were responsible for the Undertaker's "vegatative state"? I'm kind of mixed on the idea.
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Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
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Post by Krimzon on Jun 8, 2010 15:25:19 GMT -5
I've seen it referenced, but what did Tarver mess up when Bryan was kicking Cena? Bryan went to kick Cena, only for 1.9 to punch Cena first, causing AmDrag to pull his kick back. Afterwards, he then kicked Cena properly.
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Post by The Saviour on Jun 8, 2010 15:29:43 GMT -5
This is a great quote - it pretty much sums up why I think TNA still can't figure out how to do something with the "un-established" wrestlers like the X-Division guys who never really get a chance to excel. Names don't make a company - proper booking does. That is a good point, but in the case of a hostile takeover angle, wouldn't the fans have to view the invaders as threats in order to take the storyline itself seriously? Maybe one beatdown last night was enough for fans to take the NXT guys seriously, who knows, but in this case having those guys align with an established guy is probably the best way to go. I don't believe that at all. It's complete shock and awe from WWE and I'm willing to come out and say that they don't need any established leader.
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b1gjames
AC Slater
hated by many. liked by few. respected by none
Posts: 120
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Post by b1gjames on Jun 8, 2010 15:37:34 GMT -5
I absolutely loved the ending of RAW. I was actually on the verge of going on a summer hiatus from. I was actually getting ready to switch off RAW when I heard Barrett's promo. I kind of thought that maybe he would attack Bret and then Cena would come out and they would have a pull apart brawl, so I continued to watch.
What we got instead was 1000000 times better. What I really loved about the angle was that Punk tried to help Cena and got beat down again. That kind of reminded me of when the NWO first formed and you would see Sting and the Horsemen working together to fend off the NWO.
I actually hope they continue this on NXT season 2 and maybe even SD as well..
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Steveweiser
Dalek
Mickie Mickie You're So Fine... Hey Mickie!
THE GRAPS
Posts: 50,249
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Post by Steveweiser on Jun 8, 2010 15:51:51 GMT -5
Finally come round to post on this - it's one of the greatest things I've seen in WWE in a very very long time. All the little details from the attack on Punk & Gallows, to the initial attack on Cena, to turning the attention to Striker, Lawler and Roberts, to Punk trying to fight back... everything.
I think the lower guys like Tarver, Young and Sheffield will be beaten, but the likes of Bryan, Barrett, Otunga and Slater need to be protected here, especially Bryan and Barrett.
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noah9322
Trap-Jaw
Titletown, USA.
Posts: 489
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Post by noah9322 on Jun 8, 2010 15:56:10 GMT -5
Glad I'm not alone in loving the Punk fighting back thing. That was hella awesome.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
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Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Jun 8, 2010 16:02:49 GMT -5
Glad I'm not alone in loving the Punk fighting back thing. That was hella awesome. Agreed. It gave me flashbacks to the old WCW vs. NWO days, when two WCW guys that hated one another would still fight against the NWO.
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Raul
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,183
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Post by Raul on Jun 8, 2010 16:06:10 GMT -5
they should have smashed the spinner belt.
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