saintpat
El Dandy
Release the hounds!!!
Posts: 7,664
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Post by saintpat on May 13, 2011 1:22:12 GMT -5
I guess there's plenty of blame to go around, but who do you blame the most?
Or did Bret really get screwed at all?
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Post by MichaelMartini on May 13, 2011 1:26:59 GMT -5
Vince screwed him since Bret had creative control of his character. They decided on a finish and Vince changed it without telling him. Pretty cut and dry to me. The only thing I still wonder about is if Vince had his heel character already planned out or was it a by-product of the screw job?
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Post by drjayphd (feat. Pitbull) on May 13, 2011 1:30:27 GMT -5
Cinzia, presumably.  |
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Post by Evilution E5150 on May 13, 2011 1:40:27 GMT -5
even if it was Hunters idea it was still Vince that gave them the green light to go ahead with it
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Post by preferable on May 13, 2011 1:45:48 GMT -5
He wasn't screwed' at all. The notion that someone is 'screwed' during the course of a predetermined event which is always determined by the promoter by having an ending determined by the promoter is ridiculous.
It's like Leonardo DiCaprio holding a grudge against James Cameron for killing him off in Titanic.
Last minute script change that one of the performers wasn't told about. That's all.
I mean, what did Bret expect to happen? That Vince would allow the guy soon to go to WCW to beat the one remaining star he had left? Did you really expect the promoter to just have Bret walk out the next night, relinquish his title and stroll out into the WCW sunset leaving the meagre WWF wrestlers to compete for the scraps.
Even if you think Vince did the wrong thing, anyone that dumb and naive as Bret was to think ANY promoter would allow anything like that to happen, deserves all that's coming to him in respect of any unpalatable ending to his WWF tenure. You wonder how someone brought up in the business could be so monumentally idiotic to think it would happen.
It'd be like someone cast to play the role of Herod actually thinking it's possible the script would end up casting him as the good guy. it just boggles the mind that he could have been so dumb about the whole thing.
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Post by rnrk supports BLM on May 13, 2011 1:49:25 GMT -5
A whole lotta ring rats.
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Post by blake6905 on May 13, 2011 2:16:36 GMT -5
it was all a work brother
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Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on May 13, 2011 2:18:12 GMT -5
Sunny, if you listen to Shawn Michaels.
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CJ
Dennis Stamp
C.J. for Friendly wrestling discussion!
Posts: 4,180
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Post by CJ on May 13, 2011 2:23:27 GMT -5
Chyna
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Post by noleafclover1980 on May 13, 2011 2:27:09 GMT -5
Bret did. He had "reasonable" creative control, and his request was unreasonable. You do the job on the way out to who you are told to... not forfeit it on Raw so no one gets the rub. I don't care of Shawn was a prick back then, two wrongs don't make a right, and refusing to drop the belt to the top heel is unprofessional in it's own right. It's Vince's company, and Vince's belt. In the end, he's doing what's best for his business.
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Post by Citizen Zero on May 13, 2011 2:33:51 GMT -5
While I won't say Bret screwed himself, he certainly didn't help his case by acting like a diva.
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Post by Jacob Lee on May 13, 2011 2:35:18 GMT -5
In retrospect both Bret and Vince were completely unreasonable during the time period. Vince for being dishonest and altering the finish and Bret for not being mature enough to drop a fake wrestling belt that he didn't own.
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mentol
AC Slater
back for blood
Posts: 206
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Post by mentol on May 13, 2011 2:37:48 GMT -5
Vince skrewed it,of ourse,i respect Bret,Montreal Skrewjob was evidence for that
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Post by thelonewolf527 on May 13, 2011 2:43:48 GMT -5
I voted for Bret and I'll explain why.
Although Bret Hart did have creative control and Vince may have done some wrong, the fact of the matter is that if Bret Hart retained the title, Bischoff would have gone on Nitro the next night and said "WCW has signed the WWF Champion." Vince could not allow that to happen, hence Hart had to lose the title at Survivor Series no matter what. I get that Bret didn't want to lose it to Michaels...or on Canadian soil and what not, but it wasn't his place to decide that at that point time.
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Post by Hit Girl on May 13, 2011 2:54:08 GMT -5
Bret screwed himself for taking his "Canadian Hero" character too seriously.
He should have been the bigger man and dropped the title to HBK at Survivor Series.
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Post by celticjobber on May 13, 2011 2:55:35 GMT -5
I mean, what did Bret expect to happen? That Vince would allow the guy soon to go to WCW to beat the one remaining star he had left? Did you really expect the promoter to just have Bret walk out the next night, relinquish his title and stroll out into the WCW sunset leaving the meagre WWF wrestlers to compete for the scraps.Bret had several weeks left on his WWF contract, it wasn't like it was a real emergency situation where he was going to debut in WCW the next night. They had plenty of time to work out a different way for him to drop the title, hell he was willing to job it to almost anyone but Shawn Michaels. And if Vince had a problem with it, he shouldn't have allowed for creative control in Bret's WWF contract. |
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Beartato
Hank Scorpio
Conspiracy Victim
Posts: 5,913
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Post by Beartato on May 13, 2011 2:56:03 GMT -5
Even if you think Vince did the wrong thing, anyone that dumb and naive as Bret was to think ANY promoter would allow anything like that to happen, deserves all that's coming to him in respect of any unpalatable ending to his WWF tenure. You wonder how someone brought up in the business could be so monumentally idiotic to think it would happen. It'd be like someone cast to play the role of Herod actually thinking it's possible the script would end up casting him as the good guy. it just boggles the mind that he could have been so dumb about the whole thing. Thank. You. |
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Post by MichaelMartini on May 13, 2011 3:43:52 GMT -5
I mean, what did Bret expect to happen? That Vince would allow the guy soon to go to WCW to beat the one remaining star he had left? Did you really expect the promoter to just have Bret walk out the next night, relinquish his title and stroll out into the WCW sunset leaving the meagre WWF wrestlers to compete for the scraps.Bret had several weeks left on his WWF contract, it wasn't like it was a real emergency situation where he was going to debut in WCW the next night. They had plenty of time to work out a different way for him to drop the title, hell he was willing to job it to almost anyone but Shawn Michaels. And if Vince had a problem with it, he shouldn't have allowed for creative control in Bret's WWF contract. Not only that but HBK told Bret that he basically wasn't going to work safe with him. It's paraphrased from Bret's book but I believe it because he was brutally honest in it. That was the last straw with Bret and understandably so because that's the most unprofessional thing you could possibly say or do. That's the main reason why he had an anyone but him policy. It's not like he hadn't put him over in the past. If Bret was in the wrong do you think Vince would've forgiven him? He let him spit in his face and punch him in the face without retribution. He could've charged him with assault. Instead, they brought him back and had him squash Vince at Mania. We don't know for sure what Savage did but it's proof Vince WILL hold a grudge. |
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Post by Ricky Nightshade on May 13, 2011 3:45:08 GMT -5
The Rock. The PEOPLE!
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El Dandy
Don Corleone
Who are you to doubt El Dandy?
Posts: 1,901
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Post by El Dandy on May 13, 2011 4:22:54 GMT -5
It was me Bret, it was me all along!
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helped $lim jinx NXT. Woops
