Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,126
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Post by Mecca on Feb 19, 2020 8:04:01 GMT -5
In 1998 I had to suspend Val Venis’ WWF account on AOL for using gay slurs in the WWF chat room in regards to people not backing his 3rd party candidate I'm surprised that was bannable back then.
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Post by Hypnosis on Feb 19, 2020 10:57:52 GMT -5
Yamaguchi-San was a hero.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Feb 19, 2020 11:44:38 GMT -5
No, it is not. There is a debate about fairness in real sport regarding transpeople. Wrestling is wrestling it can do what it wants as long as people work safely. Boxing has Weight division and a skillful boxer can beat an brawler with power so the example put forward was a bit exaggerated. However just saying "you have to accept this now because I belive it to be true" is ridiculous. I can still be friends with transpeople, go to parties with transpeople, sleep with transpeople have 4tb of transporn on my external hard drive an still ponder whether it's fair for male to female trans people with a significant physical advantage to compete in female only categories. You are expecting the world to change with a click of a finger. Right. Hi, married to a trans woman here. Have a lot of friends online who are high profile trans voices, including notable trans woman athlete Rachel McKinnon. Basically, I know a lot about this subject. Trans women in sports have no advantage. The olympic standard for accepting trans women in sport is to be 2 years post reassignment surgery, which the actual doctors and hormone experts they consulted determined is long enough for testosterone advantages to be cleared away by changes in the human body. Bone structures change, muscle mass is lost, your stamina goes through the floor because unlike cis women you have zero testosterone, hell my wife's hands and feet actually shrunk a size. Trans women in sports is distinctly nothing like the crap that transphobes think it is. That's because like most things, their arguments based in "logic" are actually just thin veils for mega bigotry.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 12:10:57 GMT -5
Can we just stop hating on/marginalizing trans people already? We're all human, aren't we? If you really want one to hate on, you can all hate on me. Why? The moral here is DON'T be a dick to trans people.
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mcstoklasa
Hank Scorpio
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Post by mcstoklasa on Feb 19, 2020 12:24:42 GMT -5
Right. Hi, married to a trans woman here. Have a lot of friends online who are high profile trans voices, including notable trans woman athlete Rachel McKinnon. Basically, I know a lot about this subject. Trans women in sports have no advantage. The olympic standard for accepting trans women in sport is to be 2 years post reassignment surgery, which the actual doctors and hormone experts they consulted determined is long enough for testosterone advantages to be cleared away by changes in the human body. Bone structures change, muscle mass is lost, your stamina goes through the floor because unlike cis women you have zero testosterone, hell my wife's hands and feet actually shrunk a size. Trans women in sports is distinctly nothing like the crap that transphobes think it is. That's because like most things, their arguments based in "logic" are actually just thin veils for mega bigotry. Overly simplistic way to look at it.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Feb 19, 2020 12:32:27 GMT -5
That's because like most things, their arguments based in "logic" are actually just thin veils for mega bigotry. Overly simplistic way to look at it. It's accurate. The post I quoted mentions the facts (which are easy to look up, as I just did) about what happens to a male body post-transition. The physical advantage in sports disappears. However when this is mentioned, some still argue. Why? Their reason for disapproval is gone. Supposedly.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,126
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Post by Mecca on Feb 19, 2020 12:43:12 GMT -5
Overly simplistic way to look at it. It's accurate. The post I quoted mentions the facts (which are easy to look up, as I just did) about what happens to a male body post-transition. The physical advantage in sports disappears. However when this is mentioned, some still argue. Why? Their reason for disapproval is gone. Supposedly. I honestly don't know about this to be honest, so I defer here that you are right and think someone should tell the high school girls in connecticut that are suing the state saying transgender people are messing with their sports.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Feb 19, 2020 12:57:59 GMT -5
It's accurate. The post I quoted mentions the facts (which are easy to look up, as I just did) about what happens to a male body post-transition. The physical advantage in sports disappears. However when this is mentioned, some still argue. Why? Their reason for disapproval is gone. Supposedly. I honestly don't know about this to be honest, so I defer here that you are right and think someone should tell the high school girls in connecticut that are suing the state saying transgender people are messing with their sports. Here's the article I read. It's got first-hand accounts from medical professionals as well as trans athletes. www.shape.com/lifestyle/mind-and-body/how-does-transitioning-affect-transgender-athletes-sports-performance
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hassanchop
Grimlock
Who are you to doubt Belldandy?
Posts: 14,810
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Post by hassanchop on Feb 19, 2020 13:05:33 GMT -5
If you really want one to hate on, you can all hate on me. Why? The moral here is DON'T be a dick to trans people. And DON'T stick your dick without consent to trans people or any other people for that matter but I assume you already know that.
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Rave
El Dandy
Perpetually Bored
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Post by Rave on Feb 19, 2020 13:17:33 GMT -5
In 1998 I had to suspend Val Venis’ WWF account on AOL for using gay slurs in the WWF chat room in regards to people not backing his 3rd party candidate I'm surprised that was bannable back then. I'm not. You couldn't even say ass on an AOL-policed area without getting at least a warning, so it makes perfect sense that their rather draconian approach to moderation covered that as well.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Feb 19, 2020 13:35:50 GMT -5
In 1998 I had to suspend Val Venis’ WWF account on AOL for using gay slurs in the WWF chat room in regards to people not backing his 3rd party candidate I'm surprised that was bannable back then. Oh yeah, harassment and vulgarity. He was also scrolling “vote for Ralph Nader”
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,126
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Post by Mecca on Feb 19, 2020 13:45:35 GMT -5
I'm surprised that was bannable back then. Oh yeah, harassment and vulgarity. He was also scrolling “vote for Ralph Nader” Val Venis button pusher would have been a solid gimmick.
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 19, 2020 14:00:18 GMT -5
In 1998 I had to suspend Val Venis’ WWF account on AOL for using gay slurs in the WWF chat room in regards to people not backing his 3rd party candidate I'm surprised that was bannable back then. Wait, TPR, you worked for the WWF's AOL site? And yes, the AOL chat room(s) were very touchy regarding the Terms of Service. I remember getting a TOS violation for mentioning the Rocky Horror Picture Show there. /WWF and Kids' WB chats...good times.... //The Grandstand forums too.
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Feb 19, 2020 14:12:34 GMT -5
I unfollowed Venis a long time ago after reading his 9/11 conspiracy crap. Never heard his take, but it couldn't possibly be crazier than Brian Kendrick claiming the towers were holograms. Wow @ Brian Kendrick somehow having the most off the wall take in this post
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Post by hbkid718 on Feb 19, 2020 15:42:08 GMT -5
Never heard his take, but it couldn't possibly be crazier than Brian Kendrick claiming the towers were holograms. Wow @ Brian Kendrick somehow having the most off the wall take in this post Wow, I never heard that. That has to be the strangest conspiracy that I ever heard. Without getting off-topic, Venis is in the same conspiracy group as Jesse Ventura, and I'll leave it at that.
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Post by eJm on Feb 19, 2020 15:43:34 GMT -5
Wow @ Brian Kendrick somehow having the most off the wall take in this post Wow, I never heard that. That has to be the strangest conspiracy that I ever heard. Without getting off-topic, Venis is in the same conspiracy group as Jesse Ventura, and I'll leave it at that. I mean, Val actually uses Twitter so probably not. And that’s where I’LL leave that.
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Post by hbkid718 on Feb 19, 2020 15:45:16 GMT -5
Wow, I never heard that. That has to be the strangest conspiracy that I ever heard. Without getting off-topic, Venis is in the same conspiracy group as Jesse Ventura, and I'll leave it at that. I mean, Val actually uses Twitter so probably not. And that’s where I’LL leave that. I didn't mean the same actual conspiracy group, but they both believe the same thing. Actually, come to think of it, a lot of retired wrestlers believe the same thing. I forgot who else off the top of my head, but I had to unfriend others too.
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Dragonfly
Samurai Cop
...is no Barry Windham.
Posts: 2,489
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Post by Dragonfly on Feb 19, 2020 16:04:21 GMT -5
It's accurate. The post I quoted mentions the facts (which are easy to look up, as I just did) about what happens to a male body post-transition. The physical advantage in sports disappears. However when this is mentioned, some still argue. Why? Their reason for disapproval is gone. Supposedly. I honestly don't know about this to be honest, so I defer here that you are right and think someone should tell the high school girls in connecticut that are suing the state saying transgender people are messing with their sports. The girls names might be on the marquee, but this isn't their suit. The muscle here is a prominent anti-LGBT lobbying group with history of this stuff. (Remember the gay wedding cake stuff? Them.) This is about hate, not fairness. Now about the topic at hand: Some people around here seem to worried about "rapid onset gender dysphoria," or ROGD. The theory boils down to... Remember that episode of Futurama where Bender became a women so he could cheat? That, but with more "the PC thought police won't let me say ANYTHING!" attached. It also diagnoses dysphoria as a hip, trendy way for kids to act out. Four things about that: 1. The research comes from one research paper that was almost immediately discredited. 2. The author, Lisa Littman of Brown University, only surveyed the parents of dysphoric teens, not the teens themselves. 3. All of the parents surveyed were recruited from a quartet of well-known anti-trans websites. 4. No trans person I know, myself included, came out get attention. We want the exact opposite. I want to say more, but Madison is going to yell at me enough as it is. So instead, I will say this: talk to a trans person or six before buying into ROGD and the like. They'll tell you what's REALLY going on. PS: I shrunk 1.5 inches during my transition. The change is very, very real.
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Post by Brian Suntan on Feb 19, 2020 16:55:05 GMT -5
Overly simplistic way to look at it. It's accurate. The post I quoted mentions the facts (which are easy to look up, as I just did) about what happens to a male body post-transition. The physical advantage in sports disappears. However when this is mentioned, some still argue. Why? Their reason for disapproval is gone. Supposedly. The post you quoted contains incorrect facts about the IOC rules (as does the article you posted, but it appears that was written before the rules changed in 2015). As for the contents of the article, two people's experiences does not a scientific study make. Nevertheless, a MTF athlete suffering a performance decrease after transitioning means that they are worse (in sporting terms) than they were before. It tells you absolutely nothing about whether they have an advantage over cis women athletes. The article even goes on to say that trans athletes will still generally be bigger, taller and have greater bone density than those born female. Which is potentially pretty big deal when it comes to things like combat sports. How you quantify that advantage is a hugely difficult question, but the idea that it's all been proven and anyone who thinks otherwise is a bigot, is an ideological position, not a factual one.
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Johnny Flamingo
Hank Scorpio
Killing the business one post at a time
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Post by Johnny Flamingo on Feb 19, 2020 16:55:35 GMT -5
I understand the thinking of people who are not comfortable with trans-gender athletes as I find most people don’t know the difference between a person dressed in drag and a transgender person So when many people think of a trans athlete they literally think that it’s a guy dressed in drag competing against women. Add in media like these pictures and you get where the misunderstanding comes from. I don’t think it’s bigotry just a lack of understanding. Many don’t realize they have seen many trans people and had zero idea they were trans. They don’t realize most trans people aren’t freakishly big athletes In my opinion there is a need for much more understanding before it is more broadly accepted. I feel with anyone trans. Can’t imagine what you go through. Hearts out and I pray that the understanding comes sooner than later
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