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Post by wallabylikeyou on Aug 29, 2021 15:46:01 GMT -5
Reigns' injury going into the autumn of 2014 certainly didn't help, but the warning signs were there even earlier in the run up to Summerslam. While Rollins and Ambrose were telling a story of selling out and betrayal, Reigns was...pulling pranks that ended up with Stephanie vomiting all over Vicky Guerrero.
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Post by eJm on Aug 29, 2021 15:51:43 GMT -5
Reigns' injury going into the autumn of 2014 certainly didn't help, but the warning signs were there even earlier in the run up to Summerslam. While Rollins and Ambrose were telling a story of selling out and betrayal, Reigns was...pulling pranks that ended up with Stephanie vomiting all over Vicky Guerrero. Ahh yes, the ultimate babyface move; spiking a woman’s drink.
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JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 40,621
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Aug 29, 2021 15:55:28 GMT -5
Yeah, every word from Meltzer back during the Shield run was that Roman was being groomed as the top star coming out of the group and was going to be the one who mattered most. There wasn't any way to ignore what they were running with him; they wanted him to be big, and everybody saw it coming without CM Punk to spell it out. The Rumble wasn't the moment everyone went "Wait he's not Daniel Bryan BOOOOOOO", it was the moment everyone had confirmation that they were going all in on this. And in the years to follow, where they never once backed down against him, except for the annual moment where he'd be booked against Brock and they'd blink on letting him win? That's where the throat shoving came in, because people weren't having it but WWE kept on and on and on and on and on. The Rumble was just what made it real instead of theoretical. And while we’re here, people who still say the crowd were booing the Rumble from when Bryan was eliminated and never recovered pretty much ignored the fact that there were a lot of other over people in that Rumble people liked who were either eliminated quickly or thrown out like garbage by Big Show and Kane. And Roman didn’t even get put over from eliminating them, he fluked in doing it, had his cousin run in to help him out for some reason and took advantage of an already destroyed Rusev to win. And he was facing Brock Lesnar that year. How were people supposed to seriously buy this guy could do it? Yeah, that was so stupid. Show & Kane were beating the shit out of Roman & instead of throwing him out together, they decided to fight to see which one of them would eliminate him, leading to them fighting each other(conveniently near the ropes) & Roman eliminated them...making him look extremely lucky & them look extremely stupid, just piss poor booking for that Rumble.
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Post by eJm on Aug 29, 2021 15:58:48 GMT -5
And while we’re here, people who still say the crowd were booing the Rumble from when Bryan was eliminated and never recovered pretty much ignored the fact that there were a lot of other over people in that Rumble people liked who were either eliminated quickly or thrown out like garbage by Big Show and Kane. And Roman didn’t even get put over from eliminating them, he fluked in doing it, had his cousin run in to help him out for some reason and took advantage of an already destroyed Rusev to win. And he was facing Brock Lesnar that year. How were people supposed to seriously buy this guy could do it? Yeah, that was so stupid. Show & Kane were beating the shit out of Roman & instead of throwing him out together, they decided to fight to see which one of them would eliminate him, leading to them fighting each other(conveniently near the ropes) & Roman eliminated them...making him look extremely lucky & them look extremely stupid, just piss poor booking for that Rumble. Like, they worked together to eliminate half the field, why not just work together to dump the rest out, get Rusev back in to dump him out and then may the best man win? If they were having a contest on eliminations even though they’re on the same heel side, sure, but it was glaringly dumb without that.
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Post by DiBiase is Good on Aug 29, 2021 16:09:27 GMT -5
The Stooges vs. Mean Street Posse did set a record for most-watched cable match in history at the time, and is still in the top 5 to this day (and will likely remain there). I thought Hogan/Andre from The Main Event in 1988 was the most-watched match? Wasn’t it some ridiculous number like 30 million? (And that’s not WWE inflating numbers either).
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 29, 2021 16:24:47 GMT -5
The Stooges vs. Mean Street Posse did set a record for most-watched cable match in history at the time, and is still in the top 5 to this day (and will likely remain there). I thought Hogan/Andre from The Main Event in 1988 was the most-watched match? Wasn’t it some ridiculous number like 30 million? (And that’s not WWE inflating numbers either). Main Event was on Broadcast TV. They said most watched CABLE match.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Aug 29, 2021 16:27:14 GMT -5
The What chants are the ultimate litmus test for guys that can adapt to promos. Yes, they are annoying. Yes, they should stop. But they aren't an excuse for a bad promo, especially in WWE where you know they are a possibility. Feel free to throw them back in the audience's face, or incorporate them into your act. R-Truth's heel run was great because he'd let the chant feed into his instability, for example. Undertaker had the perfect counter to those chants. It's a damn shame hardly anyone else got to use it or some variant of it. "Say what if you like to sleep with your own sister." "What- BOOOOOOOO!!!" Alexa Bliss: "If you're a failure say what." Crowd: "What?" Alexa: "Exactly."
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Post by eJm on Aug 29, 2021 16:27:44 GMT -5
I thought Hogan/Andre from The Main Event in 1988 was the most-watched match? Wasn’t it some ridiculous number like 30 million? (And that’s not WWE inflating numbers either). Main Event was on Broadcast TV. They said most watched CABLE match. Yeah, from what I remember, Austin/Taker was the most watched overrun match in history and the Stooges/Mean Street Posse was, like, 5-6th most watched non-overrun? Something like that.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 29, 2021 16:31:34 GMT -5
I have no idea if any of this is true... I was just clarifying the above statement >_>
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Post by eJm on Aug 29, 2021 16:34:18 GMT -5
I have no idea if any of this is true... I was just clarifying the above statement >_> I know, I just remember hearing it recently.
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Post by DiBiase is Good on Aug 29, 2021 16:53:00 GMT -5
I thought Hogan/Andre from The Main Event in 1988 was the most-watched match? Wasn’t it some ridiculous number like 30 million? (And that’s not WWE inflating numbers either). Main Event was on Broadcast TV. They said most watched CABLE match. Ah ok, I stand corrected. Although I used to live in the US I don’t really know what was considered a cable channel or a normal broadcast channel back then (or now for that matter).
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Post by eJm on Aug 29, 2021 16:56:11 GMT -5
Main Event was on Broadcast TV. They said most watched CABLE match. Ah ok, I stand corrected. Although I used to live in the US I don’t really know what was considered a cable channel or a normal broadcast channel back then (or now for that matter). I guess it would be like how Free TV is like in the UK where there’s a set of channels available regardless of what type of package you get and then you can get a cable subscription to get more channels?
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 29, 2021 17:19:51 GMT -5
Ah ok, I stand corrected. Although I used to live in the US I don’t really know what was considered a cable channel or a normal broadcast channel back then (or now for that matter). I guess it would be like how Free TV is like in the UK where there’s a set of channels available regardless of what type of package you get and then you can get a cable subscription to get more channels? The big broadcast networks in the States are CBS, NBC, Fox, and ABC, and often CW kind of gets counted. They're technically available for free (though since all TV went digital that's a little harder to do) and subject to government regulations via the Federal Communications Commission since they make use of public airwaves to broadcast. Public TV will often get included in this, PBS. Just about everything else? Cable/satellite/subscription style.
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Post by dgenerationmc on Aug 29, 2021 18:27:45 GMT -5
It’s been brought up before, but the Fingerpoke of Doom often gets depicted as *the* definitive moment the tide swung fully against WCW and toward WWF. While many people did switch to watch Foley win, it’s too convenient a storytelling device, particularly since ratings went up, as I recall, in the immediate aftermath of the Fingerpoke. The problem was WCW’s systemic creative rot, their failure to capitalize and just have Goldberg proceed to finally destroy the nWo, and I believe a few poorly timed injuries, as well. Basically, the moment is used as a narrative crutch when the real causes of WCW’s downfall were more systemic than that. I agree with this. TFOD was a Hail Mary but it didn't do the damage, the horrible follow-up did. The moment you turn Hogan face and Flair heel at Uncensored 1999, you render the nWo angle pointless and flush the past three years of storylines down the toilet. And I still believe the nWo storyline could've been properly concluded even with the injuries during the first half of 99. It's just that WCW was falling apart so badly that they couldn't/wouldn't work towards a definitive end to the nWo, much less anything else.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Aug 29, 2021 23:15:15 GMT -5
It’s been brought up before, but the Fingerpoke of Doom often gets depicted as *the* definitive moment the tide swung fully against WCW and toward WWF. While many people did switch to watch Foley win, it’s too convenient a storytelling device, particularly since ratings went up, as I recall, in the immediate aftermath of the Fingerpoke. The problem was WCW’s systemic creative rot, their failure to capitalize and just have Goldberg proceed to finally destroy the nWo, and I believe a few poorly timed injuries, as well. Basically, the moment is used as a narrative crutch when the real causes of WCW’s downfall were more systemic than that. I agree with this. TFOD was a Hail Mary but it didn't do the damage, the horrible follow-up did. The moment you turn Hogan face and Flair heel at Uncensored 1999, you render the nWo angle pointless and flush the past three years of storylines down the towel. And I still believe the nWo storyline could've been properly concluded even with the injuries during the first half of 99. It's just that WCW was falling apart so badly that they couldn't put a definitive end to the nWo, much less anything else. Yeah, it's so hard even going through the week to week in April 1999 and try to figure out when to declare the nWo as "disbanded." By the time Slamboree in May comes around, you have Kevin Nash as a babyface champion going for newly heel DDP's title and it's safe to say the stable is dead by then (save for the nWo B-Team which actually did get a clear cut end later in the summer), but it just fizzles out rather fast once Hogan gets carried out of Spring Stampede.
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Renslayer
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
every time i come around your city...
Posts: 16,689
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Post by Renslayer on Aug 30, 2021 23:59:04 GMT -5
It’s been brought up before, but the Fingerpoke of Doom often gets depicted as *the* definitive moment the tide swung fully against WCW and toward WWF. While many people did switch to watch Foley win, it’s too convenient a storytelling device, particularly since ratings went up, as I recall, in the immediate aftermath of the Fingerpoke. The problem was WCW’s systemic creative rot, their failure to capitalize and just have Goldberg proceed to finally destroy the nWo, and I believe a few poorly timed injuries, as well. Basically, the moment is used as a narrative crutch when the real causes of WCW’s downfall were more systemic than that. Goldberg only winning the wcw title once is one of the most insane things they could've ever done. 1999 needed to be goldberg running through everybody affiliated with the nWo and going on another winning streak.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Aug 31, 2021 0:08:30 GMT -5
It’s been brought up before, but the Fingerpoke of Doom often gets depicted as *the* definitive moment the tide swung fully against WCW and toward WWF. While many people did switch to watch Foley win, it’s too convenient a storytelling device, particularly since ratings went up, as I recall, in the immediate aftermath of the Fingerpoke. The problem was WCW’s systemic creative rot, their failure to capitalize and just have Goldberg proceed to finally destroy the nWo, and I believe a few poorly timed injuries, as well. Basically, the moment is used as a narrative crutch when the real causes of WCW’s downfall were more systemic than that. Goldberg only winning the wcw title once is one of the most insane things they could've ever done. 1999 needed to be goldberg running through everybody affiliated with the nWo and going on another winning streak. That doesn't work for me, brother >_>
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,529
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Aug 31, 2021 6:40:26 GMT -5
It’s been brought up before, but the Fingerpoke of Doom often gets depicted as *the* definitive moment the tide swung fully against WCW and toward WWF. While many people did switch to watch Foley win, it’s too convenient a storytelling device, particularly since ratings went up, as I recall, in the immediate aftermath of the Fingerpoke. The problem was WCW’s systemic creative rot, their failure to capitalize and just have Goldberg proceed to finally destroy the nWo, and I believe a few poorly timed injuries, as well. Basically, the moment is used as a narrative crutch when the real causes of WCW’s downfall were more systemic than that. Goldberg only winning the wcw title once is one of the most insane things they could've ever done. 1999 needed to be goldberg running through everybody affiliated with the nWo and going on another winning streak. Goldberg's WCW tenure is the tale of 2 halves. The first half, up until he dropped the title they booked him to damn near perfection overall. From Starrcade 98 on, he was booked like total asscheeks
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Aug 31, 2021 7:14:23 GMT -5
"My philosophy is, 'Help yourself,' not 'Hurt the other guy.'"
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Aug 31, 2021 7:46:09 GMT -5
Goldberg only winning the wcw title once is one of the most insane things they could've ever done. 1999 needed to be goldberg running through everybody affiliated with the nWo and going on another winning streak. Goldberg's WCW tenure is the tale of 2 halves. The first half, up until he dropped the title they booked him to damn near perfection overall. From Starrcade 98 on, he was booked like total asscheeks His 2000 is one of the stupidest things that WCW had ever done. He comes back with fans going nuts for him, he's the top face, and they turn him heel. A turn that nobody wanted, a turn that only lasted a couple of months, and at a time when WCW was in a downward spiral a turn of the number 1 face in the company. Holy shit, did WWE actually book Goldberg better than WCW?
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