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Post by thestinger on May 24, 2007 22:23:52 GMT -5
Doesn't that sort of contradict what you said earlier when you said people boo Cena? Vince THINKS the fans will cheer whomever he tells them to. That's his mindset. And in the cases of many fans ..... he's right. Sounds like WWE fans aren't just cheering who Vince tells them to? Yes, but that won't stop him from shoving this guy down the fan's throuts. I could never take a rapping wrestler seriously so even if he were better than Chris Benoit I woulnd't like him.
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Swarm
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Post by Swarm on May 24, 2007 22:27:41 GMT -5
Doesn't that sort of contradict what you said earlier when you said people boo Cena? I could never take a rapping wrestler seriously so even if he were better than Chris Benoit I woulnd't like him. How could you know if you don't watch. If you are a wrestling fan you better pay attention, understand, and care about the business side of pro wrestling. Because unless "your favorite wrestler" makes money for his company you won't see him on TV anymore. Money can't be the only criteria. Otherwise you have to acknowledge right now that Hogan is the best wrestler who has ever lived. Hulk Hogan is the best wrestler who has ever lived.
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Post by jcdenton on May 24, 2007 22:29:10 GMT -5
Can you say a wrestler is truly a draw if the Fed he works for is the only game in town? (I mean wrestlers today.)
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Post by thestinger on May 24, 2007 22:34:26 GMT -5
How could you know if you don't watch. Because he's a rapping wrestler. I just said that. I can't take him seriously because he's a wrestler who raps. It's not that complex. Oh well, it's apples and oranges, I guess. You are fans of 'superstars' and 'sports entertainment' and I am a fan of wrestlers who put on matches. We're never going to agree on anything. TNA does suck sometimes. It sucks whenever it copies the WWE formula. It sucks when they use people like VKM or the Dudleys who bring nothing to the table but the fact that people remember them from WWE. TNA should strive to have as little in common with WWE as possible, because a lot of fans are sick of that shit. They need to drop the dead weight and BE wrestling. No zombies, or vampires or owners in the damn ring.
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Swarm
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Post by Swarm on May 24, 2007 22:37:58 GMT -5
How could you know if you don't watch. Because he's a rapping wrestler. I just said that. I can't take him seriously because he's a wrestler who raps. It's not that complex. Ok so you hate rap too. Do you not listen to rap like you don't watch WWE? Why do you hate rap?
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Post by amplifierWORSHIP! on May 24, 2007 22:38:09 GMT -5
Because he's a rapping wrestler. I just said that. I can't take him seriously because he's a wrestler who raps. it's not like he's a BAD rapper.. i don't see the issue, unless you just hate the entire genre. in which case, different strokes
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hollywood
King Koopa
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Post by hollywood on May 24, 2007 22:39:29 GMT -5
TNA does suck sometimes. It sucks whenever it copies the WWE formula. It sucks when they use people like VKM or the Dudleys who bring nothing to the table but the fact that people remember them from WWE. TNA should strive to have as little in common with WWE as possible, because a lot of fans are sick of that crap. They need to drop the dead weight and BE wrestling. No zombies, or vampires or owners in the damn ring. I do agree with this.
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Post by thestinger on May 24, 2007 22:46:14 GMT -5
You do agree? Cool. Team 3D came to my hometown and wrestled at my old school last month, and my brother and I chanted "Smells Like Bacon!" at Brother Ray and held up disparaging signs until he got in my face, snatched the signs and took them backstage with them while yelling threats at us. I've just got pictures of Ray grabbing my sign......
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Post by Jimichiro Likes Erick Rowan on May 24, 2007 22:50:49 GMT -5
You do realize that "the rapper," despite getting boo'ed on occasion, also gets some of the biggest reactions anywhere. I'm not a fan, but plenty of other people are. Enough to justify him being a main eventer. Whatever. If you say so. I've heard that he's in the main event because the boss has decided that he's 'the next big thing' and is convinced that he'll be the next Hogan or Rock. This is a guy who has said that he knows what the fans want better than they do. I also know that WWE confiscates any signs critical of him, and edit their shows to include crowd pops and boos when appropriate. If you're a WWE fan, you'll like who Vince tells you to like! I've heard several stories of a guy bringing a "Sting sucks" sign to a TNA taping & had his sign ripped up by security. I'm not saying one's better than the other because both promotions are both heavily flawed, but I've been enjoying TNA alot more than WWE since the letdown that was Wrestlemania (but I'll be fair, Lockdown was a stinker too). And with Undertaker & Triple H being absent from their respective shows, along with Batista getting a bazillion WHC matches, Lashley's uberpush, HBK's brain exploding, an impending return of Rey Mysterio & Eddiesploitation, Cena/Khali (enough said there by itself) as well as Smackdown's new Assistant General Manager (to be revealed on Friday, I won't spoil it for anybody), I don't think I will anytime soon. TNA provides me a nostalgia kick for some of the wrestlers I marked for when I was younger (Nash, Steiner , Raven, Lynn, Sting, Backlund, Cornette, even Jarrett to some extent), has shown me some of the IWC's favorite sons (Joe, AJ, Daniels, Shelley, Sabin, Sonjay, Lethal, Aries) & has a good deal of up & coming talent of their own (Abyss, Roode, Eric Young, AMW, LAX [Granted I'm a little sentimental with Abyss & Chris Harris, I saw them in several local indies before they made it to TNA]). Does TNA have its share of watse-of-space rejects that bore me to tears? Of course it does. Does it have its share of crap-ass gimmicks? Absolutely. But to say that the 'E is infoulable in comparison to TNA & that everything it does blows TNA out of the water is ridiculous as far as I'm concerned.
Is any one promotion better than the other? I'm not the right guy to judge. But all I know is that I'm more entertained by TNA's product than WWE right now. And I doubt that will change anytime soon.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on May 25, 2007 0:17:55 GMT -5
I haven't watched any "first-run" wrestling on TV(WWE, TNA) in about a month, and I couldn't be happier
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@TenaciousBe
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Post by @TenaciousBe on May 25, 2007 1:21:49 GMT -5
I'll admit I haven't read the majority of this thread, beyond the first few posts... but do we really need this exact same "OMG WHY DON'T TNA PUSH THEIR OWN TALENT INSTEAD OF WWE REJECTS" thread every single week?
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Post by The Blue Blazer on May 25, 2007 1:32:48 GMT -5
At this point pretty much every wrestler on the planet is an ex-WWE or ex-WCW wrestler.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 25, 2007 1:46:41 GMT -5
At this point pretty much every wrestler on the planet is an ex-WWE or ex-WCW wrestler. Even someone like AJ Styles who most would call a TNA guy was in WCW and wrestled one match in the WWE.
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@TenaciousBe
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Post by @TenaciousBe on May 25, 2007 3:34:59 GMT -5
^^ This is true. And let's not forget, Alex Shelley wrestled a Heat match against Simon Dean a couple years ago. Seriously, wrestlers may have been "raised" or made their name with one organization, but when it comes down to it, wrestlers are wrestlers. Most of the so-called "home grown TNA guys" came from ROH or other indy feds first anyway.
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Post by mysterydriver on May 25, 2007 8:55:02 GMT -5
One note on the "We want wrestling" chant that WWE got during the Fake Rosie/Fake Trump match...
They worked that into the angle.
It was horrible. It was dreadful. It was embarassing.
It was the first thing Donald Trump brought up when he said that Vince had lost touch with his audience. It helped jumpstart the Trump/Vince angle towards Wrestlemania.
In the meantime, Christy Hemme came out to complain about how little respect women in wrestling get, during a VKM promo...on a PPV. People started chanting, "We want wrestling!" as Christy tried her best to "plead" her case.
What did TNA do?
Nothing. They ignored it, and we got even more VKM/Christy segments (Considered by many: The worst part of Impact, if not TNA itself). In fact, we got the...wonderful... BFOG/Christy strip match due to this feud.
I just wanted to bring that up.
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Post by bigbadbrad07 on May 25, 2007 8:56:44 GMT -5
Well if you stopped watching at 20 minutes into the show you'll miss seeing LAX and Samoa Joe wrestle. Perhaps you should, I don't know, watch the entire show? By the way, I could watch a WWE show and be like, Chris Benoit? Booker T? Finlay? Mysterio? What's with all these WCW guys? Why don't they push WWE guys? Ummm.... They do push WWE guys, that's the majority of who they push, HOMEGROWN TALENT. Since when was there a rule that said only homegrown guys needed to be pushed?
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hollywood
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Post by hollywood on May 25, 2007 9:22:26 GMT -5
Ummm.... They do push WWE guys, that's the majority of who they push, HOMEGROWN TALENT. Since when was there a rule that said only homegrown guys needed to be pushed? It's a delicate balance mainstream promotions have to make. In WWE's case, they tend refuse to push anyone BUT their homegrown guys--John Cena, Randy Orton, Bobby Lashley--while guys that made names for themselves elsewhere seem to remain forever in midcard hell--Chris Benoit, Tommy Dreamer, RVD. In TNA's case, they tend to do the opposite. Kurt Angle, Christian Cage, and Sting were immediately pushed to the moon, while guys that TNA had spent years grooming were pushed aside to make room--AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Christopher Daniels. If you refuse to push outsiders, fans will complain. If you refuse to push your own guys, fans will complain. It's best to try and find a middle ground somewhere. However, WWE's insistance on strictly pushing their own home-grown guys is paying for them a bit better than TNA's strategy.
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Post by thestinger on May 25, 2007 10:09:23 GMT -5
I just wanted to bring that up. Ok, you brought it up. I don't know what it's supposed to prove. That's what Vince always does. Whenever the fans are just disgusted with him he works it into his character. He screws Bret Hart after years of loyalty on Bret's part? Suddenly it becomes his new character! "I'm the evil heel who screws over deserving wrestlers!"He puts on an awful disgrace that gets fans chanting TNA? That's intentional too..... yeah the evil heel hates the fans and is trying to punish them..... Right..... It's the business equivalent of a guy who trips and knocks over a bookcase and then says proudly, "I MEANT to do that!" Catfish Jake wrote: I've heard several stories of a guy bringing a "Sting sucks" sign to a TNA taping & had his sign ripped up by security.I really doubt this. Team 3D are the epitome of undeserving WWE guys given a push over more talented TNA teams. Despite their insane pushes, I see "3D Sucks" signs filling the impact zone every week. Their last two appearances have been met with "3D Sucks" chants. So if they don't confiscate anti-3d signs, I don't believe they confiscate anti-Sting signs. WWE on the other hand makes no secret of their policy of not allowing signs critical of Cena. I know a guy whose sign of "I've Cena'nuff" was taken and he saw an entire arena's worth of signs taken that night.
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Post by Hugh Mungus on May 25, 2007 10:13:58 GMT -5
Angle got fired for being a drug addict. He was not fired. He asked for his release, and he got it. And that only happened because he promised that he'd return to the company and sign a new long-term contract in a year. It all depends on whom you believe, Vince or Kurt, though the general opinion is that the public will side against Vince. Don't forget that Kurt was in his "Krazy Kurt" phase when he did all his interviews at that time.
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Post by thestinger on May 25, 2007 10:20:10 GMT -5
It all depends on whom you believe, Vince or Kurt, though the general opinion is that the public will side against Vince. Don't forget that Kurt was in his "Krazy Kurt" phase when he did all his interviews at that time. Actually WWE confirms that Kurt had what appeared to be an emotional breakdown after signing a long-term deal. They admit that when they gave him his release he promised he'd return in about a year. That's why he got the hero's send-off on the air and not a low key "best luck in future endevours" There's no disagreement regarding the facts between the two parties. Kurt asked for his release, he got it, and he promised to return -- which was a bold-faced lie. WWE is pissed off at Kurt for lying, which he fully admits he did in order to be free.
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