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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jul 1, 2008 17:22:40 GMT -5
I'm a bit concerned. He won after Batista pwned Edge. And against JBL, he needed Cena's help.
I can understand why they did those two things, but I hope its not a trend that CM Punk is only champ due to assists.
Also, what about his finisher? It's godly, but how can he pull it off against someone like Kane or Cena?
I really dont want him to be a paper champion, but I have a hunch that they didn't have plans after Vince "swerved" us and kept both titles on RAW, and noticed that Punk had a title shot that they weren't even going to consider having him win with and decided to waste it last night cause it made logical sense as opposed to Edge having a match on RAW for a title when there was no one there to force him too.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 29, 2008 23:12:42 GMT -5
Sounds awesome! Brilliant booking. How do you create buzz for this new title? Put one of the most over, bubble-gum face divas with it. The crowd will go apecrap for this title with Maria at the helm, and eat it (and her) up every week. This will draw some MAJOR heel heat for Natalya when she starts interfering in these Diva title matches. Then, by the time SS rolls around the title has enough interest invested in it from Maria to make the title match (and subsequently, the title) interesting. Brilliant WWE, brilliant. Your check is in the mail from Stamford Uh, please tell me why Natalya should be crowned the first winner over Maria, with no reference to wrestling skills. We've seen distraughtened face chases heel over and over again. And we just had the Pheonix monster push with the Womans title. And she isn't popular. At all. For a new title, it's essential to have a hook to it or else it'll get lost in the shuffle. Please tell me how a Kong push will benefit the creation of a new title when it's holder is as over as a fart in church. Especially if a Kong push involves her facing the diva jobbers. Not only does it shit on the title, it shits all over the Smackdown women's division. This way, you have Maria, one of the most popular divas to associate the title with. You have a strong heel in Natalya that is hell-bent on that title. You get the face in peril as she can't stand toe-to-toe with the heel and she knows it, but still tries her hardest. You build the face up and invest emotion into her (and the title by relation) and at SummerSlam Natalya wins the title, and this way, after the title has been established and deemed credible to the fans, you get the person who should hold the title to have it. That's the only way I could see it happen. Unless they turn Natalya face and have Victora turn on her, but aside from the t-shirts they haven't invested enough in their friendship on TV to justify a break-up yet. Unless, of course, you want to shit all over this new title already and have a Kong streak.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 29, 2008 22:46:29 GMT -5
CM Punk push?
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 29, 2008 18:56:53 GMT -5
I have a thing for light skinned black girls. So Layla.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 29, 2008 18:48:36 GMT -5
Sounds awesome! Brilliant booking.
How do you create buzz for this new title? Put one of the most over, bubble-gum face divas with it. The crowd will go apeshit for this title with Maria at the helm, and eat it (and her) up every week. This will draw some MAJOR heel heat for Natalya when she starts interfering in these Diva title matches.
Then, by the time SS rolls around the title has enough interest invested in it from Maria to make the title match (and subsequently, the title) interesting.
Brilliant WWE, brilliant.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 28, 2008 15:23:31 GMT -5
I'd say 7-8 years. Can't remember. Around WM17 was when I first started. It all happened because I wanted to see Major Gunns nude.
One day (and this was like 8th grade, mind you) I was home sick and wanted to see Major Gunns nude. So, I visited TheMayhem.com and they had them. From there, I got hooked. The first real major news item I remember was them knowing about Austin's heel turn at WM and I didn't believe it.
And now I believe dirt sheets.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 28, 2008 0:47:00 GMT -5
JR doesn't do post-production. He said himself he wont do it.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 27, 2008 17:59:04 GMT -5
Are you kidding me? The only reason they moved Kendrick was so that London could be the one behind this Vince fiasco.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 26, 2008 16:16:47 GMT -5
I found one for £54.99 I'm not sure what that translates to in american currency. Anyone want to translate? One pound is worth roughly 2 dollars.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 25, 2008 12:32:54 GMT -5
Why dont they just pair him with AAE again?
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 23, 2008 20:43:45 GMT -5
That was way too convenient. My thoughts exactly. Figures, the one time I watch RAW some massive shit goes down. I just beat Devil May Cry 4 and turned on USA and this totally ruined my buzz.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 23:51:57 GMT -5
Modern day WWE apologists make me laugh. They remind me of the FEMA PR department after Katrina. I wouldn't take it to that extreme, but I wonder why people try so hard. The majority of us here don't like the product or the lack of fresh faces. Does the Attitude Era get sugar-coated? Yeah, but a lot of it was great. The competitiveness of WCW/WWF made shit seem like candy. But at the time, we all lapped it up. Now look what it's become. It's not fair to compare the products to each other. It's also not fair to expect us fans who watched the "golden eras" to expect anything less. Should we glorify Vince while he piles on the same old shit over and over again just because there isn't a new breakout star or a great era? I hate that a lot of people say we've been "spoiled" with the Attitude Era. You know, people are "spoiled" with 3D graphics but that doesn't mean that the video game industry didnt know how to adapt. And you know how many amazing games are coming out now?
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 23:24:44 GMT -5
It's very hard to compare eras now because we have two titles and two shows. Maybe the ME scene would have been more interesting it you had Edge, HHH, HBK, Orton, Taker, and Batista floating in and out of the title scene. I think it would be. The brand split was to make new stars, but really, it's just gotten to the point where its one brand built around 3 people.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 23:18:51 GMT -5
That's 24 people in 5 years. I'm willing to wager the preceeding 5 years didn't see 24 guys in title matches. You know because the elimination chamber had nothing to do with that... I'm just gonna step away.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 19:04:05 GMT -5
A lot of sensible and not so sensible points so far... I think it's silly being so surprised about the relative lack of variation in wrestling's Main Event scene. Historically speaking, wrestling feds, and more significantly WWF/E, have always been relying on the Good v Evil scheme, that being the typical One on One situation. Once a man was "defeated" (ie, once the storyline had run its course) it was time for another guy to step in. WWF worked like that until well into the Attitude Era, when they kept keeping another Good/Evil pairing as backups for the title scene. And that was a necessity more than a choice. With 2 hours a week of Star v Star product to present, it was impossible keeping the Hogan v ___ formula going on with no variation. Sure, Attitude Era stories were more multilayered than the current ones, but it was mostly due to the need of having compelling and over the top, "open" angles to keep fans watching.Nowadays they have basically reverted to the old school formula: "I'm the Champ" "I want your belt". Triple H and Cena are where they are because the fans still prefer watching them than a fresh, but not-so-appealing, MVP v Punk, or Kennedy v Morrison. Having more variety right now would just devalue what's left of the credibility of the titles. Back when kayfabe was running wild, it was easier to push a "nobody" to the stars. Now it would just look stupid. Even worse passing the titles around like a joint... Most fans know it's scripted, so having Jeff, Matt, Kennedy, Carlito, Santino, Jericho, JBL, Burchill and Noble main eventing a PPV from today til WrestleMania XXV wouldn't help at all. On the contrary, it would reek of a desperation move. Exactly. But you can't go backwards from there, it's anti-progressive. It's a horrible business technique that sucks for the consumers. Starve them and then when you need it pull the ace from the pocket. It reeks of bullshit.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 18:59:58 GMT -5
It should be noted that with Cena out for four months last year, Triple H out for nine and Orton, who will probably miss a few months this year, non only have the three not been spending every week of the last several years fighting each other, the three have spent very little time active at the same time over the past two calendar years. Again, if you're going to have five people hold a championship on a show between 2005 and 2008, with two of them no longer on said show, it only makes sense that one of those three be in the title matches. The more I think about it, it sounds like people want the title to be passed around like it was toward the demise of WCW. In reality, for as "enlightened" as Internet fans like to think they are, they basically seem to want every challenger who is built up to take the title. This is evident in any discussion dealing with Triple H, as any challenger who he didn't drop the belt to was "buried" by the Game. Nevermind, that King Booker, Chris Jericho and Rob Van Dam all stayed relevant and near the top of the card. Hell, the only one of those three who didn't have a Heavyweight title run following losing to Triple H is a guy who has publicly stated that he doesn't care about winning and losing because the outcome of the match is not important, but whether the crowd is entertained. Honestly, the main event picture isn't as stale as some of you want to believe. It's simply most here are apparently still in love with the Crash TV concept of constant title changes, whether they want to admit it or not. I think you should also look into how many Main Events had 2 of the 3 involved. Also, look into repeated Main Event matches and you'll see that there is a giant span of the same shit going on over and over with little to no progress. That's what makes it horrid.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 18:55:27 GMT -5
4 words. Punisher shirt. Candy jar.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 21, 2008 15:29:13 GMT -5
Where's the multi-quote option here? 1) popogijo -- you're wrong. It's totally not the same. Should I (and that other poster, sorry, forgot your name) restate what we said? In the attitude era there was substance to the ME. Also, it didn't last as long as this 5 year reign. People get tired of guys faster. No crap we'd all be happier with Burke and CM Punk MEing. We haven't seen them there yet. And I could write material for about 20 guys. Not so hard. I think wrestling might be one of the easiest things to write if you have a knack for it. I e-fedded, and we ran some amazing stories. It's kinda like EWR though, you go through a bunch of tried and true storylines, tweak them, and they should work. Like a giant killer angle. Where's my giant killer angle? They have 23456y7uiuy6t543 different "monster" characters. Who's going to slay them all? Pick a character to do it, and it all falls into place. Not so hard. But for the tourney, to get everyone involved you have to add some elements like a girl, or whatever. Just make their arcs flow into the tourney. I don't "armchair book", but if I had the time or the will to do so, I'd bet I can come up with something to fill 3 months. I just don't see the point because it will get me no where. 2) Jtre - You're correct. However, that doesn't mean that WWE should stick to one simple monthly device because it drew the highest. People get tired of the same thing over and over. Which is why Fonzie jumped the shark. And for the undercard, I meant anything that isnt the top fued. I'm sorry, that's how I enterpret the ME of a promotion -- the top fued. I should have made that clearer. I apologize. Also, a face like Raven could work, or just use a heel trying to screw massive over babyface #1. But through involving all these other people the viewer invests interest in people other than the MEers (the top heel/face duo) which doesnt over saturate the ME act. Besides, it's not meant to be a great 3 month story arc -- I came up with it in 30 seconds :-P 3) wrestlecrapcrap, the stories you talk about never amounted to anything. Nor were they in the ME. The ME has been neutered to just "ME WANT TITLE". With the occasional kick to Cena's dad. Add in the oversaturation of these 3 guys in 5 years and it's ridiculious. I do agree with you on the Batista story. That was the last good story I've seen in the E, next to the butchered Edge/Hardy fued. But the fact still remains, aside from 1-3 innovative and catching stories, it's mostly been the same old crap. And it's doubled with the brand extension (to a degree). And the topic at hand is RAW, not headlining PPVs. And I feel Jericho has been buried since he came back. How can you say he hasn't? He came in with so much interest and they killed it in less than a month by feeding him to Orton. Then he went on to JBL? Yeah, they killed any momentum he had. Sorry, but it's true. Don't go off saying people like HBK haven't been in the ME scene for a long time and they haven't killed his credibility, cause he has much more than Jericho ever did. HBK can take a beating and still challenge for the title the next day. Jericho never really broke into the ME scene as a ME staple, and he needed that extra push when he came back to solidify his position. Which we all know by now, because of the way he's been buried and not given the chance to gain prestige in the company, is midcarder for life. You make some good points, especially now that you cleared up the tournament idea. I still say in order for the tournament idea to work you have to have a heel who, oddly enough, people won't miss seeing in the ring for several weeks, but the idea is pretty cool. I disagree with the idea that Jericho has been buried. He didn't lose to Randy Orton, he won his feud with JBL, he beat (arguably) the hottest guy in WWE for the I-C title, he put Shawn Michaels threw at TV in a highly memorable moment and finished RAW the other night standing over top of a downed Triple H and John Cena. I wouldn't say he's been buried. Finally, I don't think writing wrestling is as easy as you made it sound. Remember, coming up with ideas in an e-fed or fantasy fed is not the same thing as constructing and implementing ideas that will draw money in the real world. I beg to differ. WWE has a golden chance right now to flex their creative muscle and throw things at the wall to see what hits. They are the only nationally-known brand of wrestling in America and Canada. Internationally, they are seen as a novelty and will draw regardless. Same domestically. While they pile out the same old Cena/HHH/Orton shit over and over, why not try new ideas? They don't have to draw. The company with a top act (f***, even without one) will draw regardless. The undercard is something that you get as a bonus. No one buys PPVs for the undercard, yet that is where all the development and creativity really needs to lie. Then you take that piece of shit that stuck to the wall, and promote it. Then you have a fresh new act up front that you know will draw. That's WWE's problem. They just don't try anymore. If you take anything away from this post it's this -- the E has no competition, they will draw regardless. They can do whatever they want and it'll draw their inital 3.0 fanbase. Therefore booking for them (especially right now) is uber-easy. I just read an article on Comcast today. Same prinicipals. E doesn't try because they don't have to. Like Comcast, where they own a monopoly in most of the places they operate.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 20, 2008 22:35:00 GMT -5
Where's the multi-quote option here?
1) popogijo -- you're wrong. It's totally not the same. Should I (and that other poster, sorry, forgot your name) restate what we said? In the attitude era there was substance to the ME. Also, it didn't last as long as this 5 year reign. People get tired of guys faster. No shit we'd all be happier with Burke and CM Punk MEing. We haven't seen them there yet.
And I could write material for about 20 guys. Not so hard. I think wrestling might be one of the easiest things to write if you have a knack for it. I e-fedded, and we ran some amazing stories. It's kinda like EWR though, you go through a bunch of tried and true storylines, tweak them, and they should work.
Like a giant killer angle. Where's my giant killer angle? They have 23456y7uiuy6t543 different "monster" characters. Who's going to slay them all? Pick a character to do it, and it all falls into place. Not so hard.
But for the tourney, to get everyone involved you have to add some elements like a girl, or whatever. Just make their arcs flow into the tourney. I don't "armchair book", but if I had the time or the will to do so, I'd bet I can come up with something to fill 3 months. I just don't see the point because it will get me no where.
2) Jtre - You're correct. However, that doesn't mean that WWE should stick to one simple monthly device because it drew the highest. People get tired of the same thing over and over. Which is why Fonzie jumped the shark. And for the undercard, I meant anything that isnt the top fued. I'm sorry, that's how I enterpret the ME of a promotion -- the top fued. I should have made that clearer. I apologize.
Also, a face like Raven could work, or just use a heel trying to screw massive over babyface #1. But through involving all these other people the viewer invests interest in people other than the MEers (the top heel/face duo) which doesnt over saturate the ME act.
Besides, it's not meant to be a great 3 month story arc -- I came up with it in 30 seconds :-P
3) wrestlecrapcrap, the stories you talk about never amounted to anything. Nor were they in the ME. The ME has been neutered to just "ME WANT TITLE". With the occasional kick to Cena's dad. Add in the oversaturation of these 3 guys in 5 years and it's ridiculious. I do agree with you on the Batista story. That was the last good story I've seen in the E, next to the butchered Edge/Hardy fued. But the fact still remains, aside from 1-3 innovative and catching stories, it's mostly been the same old shit. And it's doubled with the brand extension (to a degree). And the topic at hand is RAW, not headlining PPVs.
And I feel Jericho has been buried since he came back. How can you say he hasn't? He came in with so much interest and they killed it in less than a month by feeding him to Orton. Then he went on to JBL? Yeah, they killed any momentum he had. Sorry, but it's true.
Don't go off saying people like HBK haven't been in the ME scene for a long time and they haven't killed his credibility, cause he has much more than Jericho ever did. HBK can take a beating and still challenge for the title the next day. Jericho never really broke into the ME scene as a ME staple, and he needed that extra push when he came back to solidify his position.
Which we all know by now, because of the way he's been buried and not given the chance to gain prestige in the company, is midcarder for life.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jun 20, 2008 17:48:05 GMT -5
And for whatever reason the E can't get away from that formula. You know what would be amazing to fill in 2 months worth of material?
One month the undercard fued is 2 guys for the number one contendership after the PPV. Shit, wouldn't that be nice to see again? And it builds to the next month with the contender already established!!!!!11!
Then the champ can take a break one month and they can run a number one contenders tourney with everyone trying to screw everyone and the champ has an invested interest in one of the guys and tries to manipulate the tourney in his favor. Then fueds can grow from other pair-ups, such as the semi's getting a match because semi one f***ed over semi two.
For God's sake...that took me about 30 seconds to think up of, and it's about 3 months worth of material. And it covers the undercard as well.
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