Do kid wrestling fans ruin everything?

[willywonka666]

This is almost true of anything. God knows I've hated tv shows that got popular and were toned down. I didn't feel it was for kids as much as it was to reach a broader demographic. Larry the Cable guy and Epic Movie reach the broadest of demographics if that tells you anything.

[Shy Guy]

kids make everything so simple. they're easy to cater to because when you get them at a young age, they'll believe what you tell them. if they're told to boo MVP because hes full of himself and mean to people they will. they'll cheer cm punk because they're told he loves wrestling just like they do.

i was watching raw once (taped on the DVR) and an eight year old girl watched it with me for a while. she isn't too big on wrestling, but she knew right away who the good guys were and who the bad guys were just from the announce team.

she didn't like king booker. why? because he isn't a real king.
jeff hardy is cool. why? because he does flips and has different colours in his hair.

things are so simple for kids, that i think we get so into ourseleves and remind ourselves "oh, i'm on the internet posting on a wrestling forum, therefore i have to hate everything," that we forget why we like wrestling in the first place.

because hulk hogan told us to say our prayers and take vitamins?
because mr. perfect could spit his gum in the air and swat it away?
because ric flair says "wooooooo"?

stop being a smark for one raw, or smackdown, or ecw. then you'll remember why you even started to watch it in the first place.

[Loki]

Being 20-something (or older) and complaining about wrestling being aimed to kids/teens is like being an old school hard rock/metal fan who can't get over the fact kids nowadays think Nickelback or Sum41 rock like nobody has ever rocked before.

Every product evolves, (for the worse or for the better, it depends), and old fans will either turn away in disgust, or stick around out of habit. While new fans won't question if it's better/worse than before, because there's no before for them. It's hic et nunc for them.

Of course I cringe when I hear kids saying "Messi and Ronalidnho are the best ever" because I remember Maradona, Platini, Baggio, Van Basten etc... But they don't, and for them, the New Guys are the measuring stick.

We've got two paths to choose from:

1) ranting endlessly and forcing our views on new fans.
2) watching and trying to enjoy the novelties as much as we can, allowing the new fans to love every second of it like we did when it was our time.

[BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps]

Honestly, I don't see how either "side" is hurting wrestling fandom. Some like it serious, some like it wacky. It's all good.

It's when individual fans lose their sense of reason and act like tools when you've got a problem- and that can happen if you're 10, 20 or 30.

[AriadosMan]

radioclash5150 said:

Honestly, I don't see how either "side" is hurting wrestling fandom. Some like it serious, some like it wacky. It's all good.

It's when individual fans lose their sense of reason and act like tools when you've got a problem- and that can happen if you're 10, 20 or 30.

Ironically, this happens much less on this forum than most others, which makes the complaints about "angry people" ruining the experience even more pointless.

[Libertine]

What I find quite dis-heartening is when people on wrestling forums describe how they went to a show and booed some poor kids hero just because they were being cheered. Very pathetic.

I'd much rather be a 'mark' moreso than the jaded fan I've become due to age and internet access.

[joeman]

Wrestling, in any period, was never suppose to be broken down analytically for fans to enjoy. That includes the era of terrorities, where the majority of the US fans were actual marks.

[willywonka666]

I can watch the eighties stuff I grew up with and love every minute of it. The problem I have with today is it's just not any good to me. It's not aimed at me and maybe I would like it if I was 8-so I'll stick with what I like and what I grew up with.

[AriadosMan]

willywonka666 said:

I can watch the eighties stuff I grew up with and love every minute of it. The problem I have with today is it's just not any good to me. It's not aimed at me and maybe I would like it if I was 8-so I'll stick with what I like and what I grew up with.

The thing is, in the 80s there was no "Attitude Era" to compare it too. Now you have people who are annoyed that its not like the Attitude Era and other people who are annoyed that its not like the 80s.

[Chainsaw]

radioclash5150 said:

Honestly, I don't see how either "side" is hurting wrestling fandom. Some like it serious, some like it wacky. It's all good.

It's when individual fans lose their sense of reason and act like tools when you've got a problem- and that can happen if you're 10, 20 or 30.

You know, that's the smartest thing anyone's said in this thread yet. Thanks for putting things in perspective, Clash.

[Loki]

radioclash5150 said:

Honestly, I don't see how either "side" is hurting wrestling fandom. Some like it serious, some like it wacky. It's all good.

It's when individual fans lose their sense of reason and act like tools when you've got a problem- and that can happen if you're 10, 20 or 30.

But a 10 years old kid has much more right to be happy/mad/sad for something that happened on a TV show featuring big men pretending to beat the hell out of eachother, than a 20-ish guy who's all bent out of shape because one of said big men ins't getting the role he thinks he deserves.

A teenage girl can get emotional while watching Gilmore Girls and it's somewhat ok.
If a grown man bitches about the secondary character being miscasted or about the script being clichè or reused from an obscure 80s sit-com, well... that's less understandable.

[joeman]

realfakerazor said:

willywonka666 said:

I can watch the eighties stuff I grew up with and love every minute of it. The problem I have with today is it's just not any good to me. It's not aimed at me and maybe I would like it if I was 8-so I'll stick with what I like and what I grew up with.

The thing is, in the 80s there was no "Attitude Era" to compare it too. Now you have people who are annoyed that its not like the Attitude Era and other people who are annoyed that its not like the 80s.

That and you can't compare eras. It is like comparing the TNMT from the 80's to the one in the early 2000s. Alot of things outside of wrestling influenced wrestling during those time periods and things always change.

[BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps]

loki said:

radioclash5150 said:

Honestly, I don't see how either "side" is hurting wrestling fandom. Some like it serious, some like it wacky. It's all good.

It's when individual fans lose their sense of reason and act like tools when you've got a problem- and that can happen if you're 10, 20 or 30.

But a 10 years old kid has much more right to be happy/mad/sad for something that happened on a TV show featuring big men pretending to beat the hell out of eachother, than a 20-ish guy who's all bent out of shape because one of said big men ins't getting the role he thinks he deserves.

A teenage girl can get emotional while watching Gilmore Girls and it's somewhat ok.
If a grown man bitches about the secondary character being miscasted or about the script being clichè or reused from an obscure 80s sit-com, well... that's less understandable.

That comes with the territory of being a nerd about something, and contrary to popular belief, wrestling nerds make up a healthy portion of a promotion's income (or at least far more than the "5%" myth).

I'd say you're in good shape as long as you can step away and give the wrestlers respect, as they've always been underrated as overall talent packages.

[A Dubya (El Hombre Muerto)]

radioclash5150 said:

loki said:

I'd say you're in good shape as long as you can step away and give the wrestlers respect, as they've always been underrated as overall talent packages.

Definitely.

[TRUTH TELLER]

loki said:

But a 10 years old kid has much more right to be happy/mad/sad for something that happened on a TV show featuring big men pretending to beat the hell out of eachother, than a 20-ish guy who's all bent out of shape because one of said big men ins't getting the role he thinks he deserves.

Ok, rambling rant time!

I disagree. Children don’t have any extra right to anything over anyone else. I hate that mentality. Get in line with the rest of the fans. We’re all equal in importance. I don’t subscribe to the beautiful and unique snowflake mentality most people seem to have here. I owe your children nothing. They mean nothing to me. Sorry. But it’s true. I respect passion for the business, and if they fall into that category, I accept them, and applaud them! Welcome aboard. But at the same time, I’m not mollycoddling their little sensitive dispositions if by chance there’s a certain issue or angle I feel strongly for or against. I’m not going to alienate them, mind you, but wrestling doesn’t “belong to them”. It’s all of ours. I’m not stepping aside for anybody. Sorry.

That said, you don't have to denounce the older fans who have "Incorrect" reactions to what they're watching. Kids have no more of a right to get angry or happy about anything than anyone else. I don't subscribe to the notion that wrestling is just for kids and we adults need to just quietly go along for the ride. I look at wrestling like I look at any other TV show I'm emotionally invested in. Just because a small child lacks the base intellect and common sense to sense something being absurd (and that’s fine), doesn't mean we don't have to notice it/comment on it. As long as we're not imposing our wills and ruining their approach to the sport, I don't see a problem. There's tons of people who watch and scrutinize the shows they love. I think it's a real simpleton approach to just blindly accept what you're being spoon-fed even if you don't like it. All the power to kids loving who they like, but wrestling also belongs to me, and I'm damn well going to love, hate, promote or bemoan whatever the hell I want to. I'm a paying customer and a life-time viewer and that's my right. Some people might think it’s silly to take certain things too seriously, but for a lot of folks, wrestling is a big part of their life. Something that’s seen them invest time and huge sums of money and emotion into. I don't understand Trekkies and other fringe fanatics of certain TV shows, but I don't go and criticize them for their educated opinions and love of their particular product. And I certainly don’t go around telling them that they need to compromise their beliefs and opinions, because newer fans are now more important than they are. Who says? I’m of the mindset that new people need to assimilate themselves into something, not the other way around. You’re joining a fraternity.

I think what it really comes down to here, is that there’s a huge contingent of ever-growing fans that are becoming the new “IWC”. Only, instead of bemoaning wrestling angles and wrestlers, they’re burying a fringe group of fans that they get angry with, because for whatever reason, they hold certain aspects of the sport to a higher standard than they do. And this angers them. I see it constantly here. People bandy around the term “smark” like it’s some sort of insult, not realizing that they themselves are the true smarks, passing judgment on people because they dare not have the same views and opinions. Your opinion is not worth more than anyone else’s. You hold no right or privilege to tell someone they need to get over anything or accept anything or change anything about how they feel. If they want to like John Cena because he works his ass off and seems like a pretty a genuine person, you hold no right to bury that because you see him as a one dimensional manufactured WWE creation. You can love Triple H and see him as the best and denounce all the rumors of backstage shenanigans all you want, and see him as truly the talented, passionate wrestler he is. But at the same time, you have to be man enough to at least reserve the idea that maybe, in certain cases, your beloved H’s may have f***ed a few people over on the way up and to maintain a position he may be obsessed with, because at its root, he’s a mark. No one’s right and no one’s wrong. It’s all of these things. Yet, we all fight and argue over things in black and white as each side passionately argues, but never once tries to use logic—the one undisputed destroyer of arguments. (if you can’t prove your argument with logic, it means you’re wrong). But hey, whatever. I’ll still respect your opinions as long as it’s done in an intelligent, coherent manner. But don’t tell me how to feel or what to think or that I’m wrong. Because, you can’t prove it.

Bottom line to my babbling is that when it comes to wrestling, no one is right. No group is more important than any other group. If you pay for and support a product, you’re important. You’re not a loser for over-thinking continuity, and you’re no less of a fan if you just watch it because it makes you laugh. We’re all equal. Let’s start treating each other that way for once. Kids, marks, smarks & casuals. Group hug, you strange mishmash of smart & stupid people. The end.

[doytch]

i am kid fan but i know my stuff. and john cena is good since he can wrestle good and is funny with his talking. same with triple h they get to win all the time becuse they are the best and everyone gets angry with them.

people on here like wrestlers who are old becuse they are old. ric flair, shawn michaels and cm punk are old and not from people with my ages.

if shawn michaels has so good why is he wrestled against a 900 year old man who is always red? becuse everyone would have that if ric flair was fighting with john cena john cena would fu him and end his career and the wee does not get that.

[Ben Wyatt]

doytch said:

ric flair, shawn michaels and cm punk are old

*singing* One of these things is not like the others, one of these things just doesnt belong

[A Dubya (El Hombre Muerto)]

mikebowski said:

loki said:

But a 10 years old kid has much more right to be happy/mad/sad for something that happened on a TV show featuring big men pretending to beat the hell out of eachother, than a 20-ish guy who's all bent out of shape because one of said big men ins't getting the role he thinks he deserves.

Ok, rambling rant time!

I disagree. Children don’t have any extra right to anything over anyone else. I hate that mentality. Get in line with the rest of the fans. We’re all equal in importance. I don’t subscribe to the beautiful and unique snowflake mentality most people seem to have here. I owe your children nothing. They mean nothing to me. Sorry. But it’s true. I respect passion for the business, and if they fall into that category, I accept them, and applaud them! Welcome aboard. But at the same time, I’m not mollycoddling their little sensitive dispositions if by chance there’s a certain issue or angle I feel strongly for or against. I’m not going to alienate them, mind you, but wrestling doesn’t “belong to them”. It’s all of ours. I’m not stepping aside for anybody. Sorry.

That said, you don't have to denounce the older fans who have "Incorrect" reactions to what they're watching. Kids have no more of a right to get angry or happy about anything than anyone else. I don't subscribe to the notion that wrestling is just for kids and we adults need to just quietly go along for the ride. I look at wrestling like I look at any other TV show I'm emotionally invested in. Just because a small child lacks the base intellect and common sense to sense something being absurd (and that’s fine), doesn't mean we don't have to notice it/comment on it. As long as we're not imposing our wills and ruining their approach to the sport, I don't see a problem. There's tons of people who watch and scrutinize the shows they love. I think it's a real simpleton approach to just blindly accept what you're being spoon-fed even if you don't like it. All the power to kids loving who they like, but wrestling also belongs to me, and I'm damn well going to love, hate, promote or bemoan whatever the hell I want to. I'm a paying customer and a life-time viewer and that's my right. Some people might think it’s silly to take certain things too seriously, but for a lot of folks, wrestling is a big part of their life. Something that’s seen them invest time and huge sums of money and emotion into. I don't understand Trekkies and other fringe fanatics of certain TV shows, but I don't go and criticize them for their educated opinions and love of their particular product. And I certainly don’t go around telling them that they need to compromise their beliefs and opinions, because newer fans are now more important than they are. Who says? I’m of the mindset that new people need to assimilate themselves into something, not the other way around. You’re joining a fraternity.

I think what it really comes down to here, is that there’s a huge contingent of ever-growing fans that are becoming the new “IWC”. Only, instead of bemoaning wrestling angles and wrestlers, they’re burying a fringe group of fans that they get angry with, because for whatever reason, they hold certain aspects of the sport to a higher standard than they do. And this angers them. I see it constantly here. People bandy around the term “smark” like it’s some sort of insult, not realizing that they themselves are the true smarks, passing judgment on people because they dare not have the same views and opinions. Your opinion is not worth more than anyone else’s. You hold no right or privilege to tell someone they need to get over anything or accept anything or change anything about how they feel. If they want to like John Cena because he works his ass off and seems like a pretty a genuine person, you hold no right to bury that because you see him as a one dimensional manufactured WWE creation. You can love Triple H and see him as the best and denounce all the rumors of backstage shenanigans all you want, and see him as truly the talented, passionate wrestler he is. But at the same time, you have to be man enough to at least reserve the idea that maybe, in certain cases, your beloved H’s may have smurfed a few people over on the way up and to maintain a position he may be obsessed with, because at its root, he’s a mark. No one’s right and no one’s wrong. It’s all of these things. Yet, we all fight and argue over things in black and white as each side passionately argues, but never once tries to use logic—the one undisputed destroyer of arguments. (if you can’t prove your argument with logic, it means you’re wrong). But hey, whatever. I’ll still respect your opinions as long as it’s done in an intelligent, coherent manner. But don’t tell me how to feel or what to think or that I’m wrong. Because, you can’t prove it.

Bottom line to my babbling is that when it comes to wrestling, no one is right. No group is more important than any other group. If you pay for and support a product, you’re important. You’re not a loser for over-thinking continuity, and you’re no less of a fan if you just watch it because it makes you laugh. We’re all equal. Let’s start treating each other that way for once. Kids, marks, smarks & casuals. Group hug, you strange mishmash of smart & stupid people. The end.

Right on!

*Hugs mikebowski*

[Deleted]

doytch said:

i am kid fan but i know my stuff. and john cena is good since he can wrestle good and is funny with his talking. same with triple h they get to win all the time becuse they are the best and everyone gets angry with them.

people on here like wrestlers who are old becuse they are old. ric flair, shawn michaels and cm punk are old and not from people with my ages.

if shawn michaels has so good why is he wrestled against a 900 year old man who is always red? becuse everyone would have that if ric flair was fighting with john cena john cena would fu him and end his career and the wee does not get that.

CM Punk is old? Wow, you learn something new every day. Thanks, doytch!

[BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps]

doytch said:

i am kid fan but i know my stuff. and john cena is good since he can wrestle good and is funny with his talking. same with triple h they get to win all the time becuse they are the best and everyone gets angry with them.

people on here like wrestlers who are old becuse they are old. ric flair, shawn michaels and cm punk are old and not from people with my ages.

if shawn michaels has so good why is he wrestled against a 900 year old man who is always red? becuse everyone would have that if ric flair was fighting with john cena john cena would fu him and end his career and the wee does not get that.

The Wee understands how much Flair's given and how much he loves the business.