Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2010 15:51:10 GMT -5
Ah I guess I misunderstood. I still think this has an equal chance to turn out good as it does bad. With all the cries about how Sting/RVD was handled, it is still getting a huge amount of praise so I don't think they ruined either guy RVD can always bounce back, but I would have loved for RVD to come out this week just to announce he's back or align with Carter then come out next week for a match with Sting. The Impact Zone didn't even realize it was RVD until he appeared in the ring. You got to give your crowd a chance to know who's coming out - since RVD's music was brand new, people were a little confused at first I think.
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Post by Jason Todd Grisham on Mar 9, 2010 15:51:46 GMT -5
What's murky is 1. How does RVD benefit? 2. How does Sting benefit? 3. How does TNA benefit? RVD seems to benefit from nothing. Sting only benefits by cementing his heel turn, and who knows what that means in the iMPACT Zone, and besides... it's Sting. Does he really need to go heel? And is it really as shocking as a Hogan turn or if Cena were to eventually turn? So the real question is is whether this somehow benefits TNA in the long run by adding another heel, or if it fits in an overall angle TNA wants. And like I said, the long run won't be that long because he may retire in a year. That's why the reasoning is murky. What do you man you don't see how anyone benefits? RVD has his first feud, with Sting no less, in the company, Sting finally establishes himself as a heel and generates buzz, and TNA can benefit by having these two go after one another. RVD could get a feud without being beaten with a bat his first night. Sting doesn't need to be a heel at all, the question is how it fits into what TNA wants to do. And we don't even know how far this feud will go. It seems Sting's real beef is with Hogan, not RVD. So RVD's first feud ends up being a stepping stone for Sting to get to Hogan.
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Post by Michael Coello on Mar 9, 2010 15:56:15 GMT -5
What do you man you don't see how anyone benefits? RVD has his first feud, with Sting no less, in the company, Sting finally establishes himself as a heel and generates buzz, and TNA can benefit by having these two go after one another. RVD could get a feud without being beaten with a bat his first night. Sting doesn't need to be a heel at all, the question is how it fits into what TNA wants to do. And we don't even know how far this feud will go. It seems Sting's real beef is with Hogan, not RVD. So RVD's first feud ends up being a stepping stone for Sting to get to Hogan. That's the problem. we don't know what happens cause nothing has happened yet. You talk about how buried RVD is and how Sting's heel run is bad and how both don't benefit TNA, yet there's nothing to prove it either way other than that one moment on the show. Some say to wait while others are ready to crucify for this one moment.
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Post by THRJamesAngelo on Mar 9, 2010 15:57:26 GMT -5
My only beef with that entire segment was Hogan coming down and making a Hogan/Sting confrontation the center of it, leaving RVD in the back burner, even though Sting kept beating on him.
And off subject, did anyone else mark out when Flair mentioned Sting in that promo after the first "match"?
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Post by xtremehorseman on Mar 9, 2010 15:59:32 GMT -5
My problem with the angle is that RVD could have been a random jobber and the angle would be the same. RVD did not look like a big deal. He got a fluke win then turned his back on a man holding a bat who had just attacked 2 guys with said bat. It may have been ok if they had built up heat between RVD and Sting after but instead it became all about Hogan=Sting. They did'nt even cut back to RVD selling the beating, it was just Hogan-Sting. It was not as bad as Hardys debut but like Hardy they made a guy who is a big deal seem like just some guy. To someone watcheing for the first time Shannon Moore looked like a bigger deal.
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Post by Jason Todd Grisham on Mar 9, 2010 16:01:15 GMT -5
RVD could get a feud without being beaten with a bat his first night. Sting doesn't need to be a heel at all, the question is how it fits into what TNA wants to do. And we don't even know how far this feud will go. It seems Sting's real beef is with Hogan, not RVD. So RVD's first feud ends up being a stepping stone for Sting to get to Hogan. That's the problem. we don't know what happens cause nothing has happened yet. You talk about how buried RVD is and how Sting's heel run is bad and how both don't benefit TNA, yet there's nothing to prove it either way other than that one moment on the show. Some say to wait while others are ready to crucify for this one moment. I didn't say RVD is buried, and I didn't say Sting's heel run is bad. I said RVD was made to look like a chump and Sting's heel run doesn't seem to serve much of a point unless it weaves itself into a larger overall angle. The guy was heel just a year ago. RVD can come back from this, and most likely will. But feeding him to Sting to cement another heel turn doesn't make sense to me at all. And only makes him look bad to marks. Now if he gets a match with Sting and beats him at a pay per view, how does that make Sting look? I mean, if it's meant to put over RVD, that's fine. But I think TNA wants a Sting/Hogan feud.
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comahan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,899
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Post by comahan on Mar 9, 2010 16:02:30 GMT -5
My problem with the angle is that RVD could have been a random jobber and the angle would be the same. RVD did not look like a big deal. He got a fluke win then turned his back on a man holding a bat who had just attacked 2 guys with said bat. It may have been ok if they had built up heat between RVD and Sting after but instead it became all about Hogan=Sting. They did'nt even cut back to RVD selling the beating, it was just Hogan-Sting. It was not as bad as Hardys debut but like Hardy they made a guy who is a big deal seem like just some guy. To someone watcheing for the first time Shannon Moore looked like a bigger deal. It wouldnt have been the same at all imo. Because very, very few people would be over enough to get the crowd to turn on STING like that.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Mar 9, 2010 16:02:46 GMT -5
And off subject, did anyone else mark out when Flair mentioned Sting in that promo after the first "match"? YES. I loved it. As someone who was watching the first Clash of Champions on TBS when they went 45 minutes and everything since, I absolutely loved it. "Sting has finally seen the light."
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Post by Michael Coello on Mar 9, 2010 16:06:55 GMT -5
That's the problem. we don't know what happens cause nothing has happened yet. You talk about how buried RVD is and how Sting's heel run is bad and how both don't benefit TNA, yet there's nothing to prove it either way other than that one moment on the show. Some say to wait while others are ready to crucify for this one moment. I didn't say RVD is buried, and I didn't say Sting's heel run is bad. I said RVD was made to look like a chump and Sting's heel run doesn't seem to serve much of a point unless it weaves itself into a larger overall angle. The guy was heel just a year ago. RVD can come back from this, and most likely will. But feeding him to Sting to cement another heel turn doesn't make sense to me at all. And only makes him look bad to marks. Now if he gets a match with Sting and beats him at a pay per view, how does that make Sting look? I mean, if it's meant to put over RVD, that's fine. But I think TNA wants a Sting/Hogan feud. You say you aren't calling RVD buried, but you still say he was a chump and fed to Sting. Really, I don't know what else to say. You say it makes no snese to do it, I say it works well on both ends.
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Post by Clarence "Showstealer" Mason on Mar 9, 2010 16:11:45 GMT -5
I pretty much said all I wanted to say about the debut in my own "negative" thread, but in case people don't want to go there my feeling was and still is on subsquent viewings that they botched the big debut to try and save an angle they'd already botched at the beginning of the night
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Post by Widow's Peak on Mar 9, 2010 16:14:02 GMT -5
My problem with the angle is that RVD could have been a random jobber and the angle would be the same. RVD did not look like a big deal. He got a fluke win then turned his back on a man holding a bat who had just attacked 2 guys with said bat. It may have been ok if they had built up heat between RVD and Sting after but instead it became all about Hogan=Sting. They did'nt even cut back to RVD selling the beating, it was just Hogan-Sting. It was not as bad as Hardys debut but like Hardy they made a guy who is a big deal seem like just some guy. To someone watcheing for the first time Shannon Moore looked like a bigger deal. It wouldnt have been the same at all imo. Because very, very few people would be over enough to get the crowd to turn on STING like that. That's what I thought, too. I didn't like RVD getting squashed like that, but he was probably the only one in the world the crowd would cheer over Sting.
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Paco
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Post by Paco on Mar 9, 2010 16:19:35 GMT -5
I loved every second of it so I guess I couldn't disagree more with Y2J...ah well.
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Post by hajimenoippo on Mar 9, 2010 16:28:51 GMT -5
I hated his song at pwg and I hate it now
"Rob Van Dam....the whole f***ing show" repeat 10000000000x
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"Magic" Mark Hurr
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Post by "Magic" Mark Hurr on Mar 9, 2010 16:40:26 GMT -5
And off subject, did anyone else mark out when Flair mentioned Sting in that promo after the first "match"? YES. I loved it. As someone who was watching the first Clash of Champions on TBS when they went 45 minutes and everything since, I absolutely loved it. "Sting has finally seen the light." l loved that part
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Mar 9, 2010 16:51:36 GMT -5
I hated his song at pwg and I hate it now "Rob Van Dam....the whole f***ing show" repeat 10000000000x I guess they didn't play the whole song. There was a version on Youtube which sounded like the one they played last night but it had more lyrics. I'm going to miss "One of a Kind", but at least it's not Jeff Hardy's theme song.
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elryc
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Post by elryc on Mar 9, 2010 17:01:49 GMT -5
I dunno, reading this kinda make Jericho seem like a bit of a mark to me, in the sense of "we've waited how long to see this guy back in the ring, and we get THAT?"
...then again, that may just be me projecting my inner mark's reaction to that onto Jericho :-P
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Post by donners on Mar 9, 2010 17:12:23 GMT -5
He's right. It was a ludicrous way to debut arguably the hottest free agent available.
I can understand that they want to get Sting over as a heel, but there are countless people to feed to him.
I can understand that they want to save his first real match, but there are ways to do that without a protracted beat-down to introduce him to the company.
It was just a bad call.
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dpg
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Post by dpg on Mar 9, 2010 17:27:30 GMT -5
Everyone knows who RVD is, he's a popular guy, he didn't stay down against sting and eventhough he was being beaten with a bat, kept coming back. Quite how that's dumping on him I don't know, as the storyline has only just started. We don't know what will happen next week, perhaps RVD gets revenge? And as for the crowd not knowing RVD was coming out? Perhaps the giant green 'RVD' on the screen and the theme music saying his name over and over might have been a clue.
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dpg
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Post by dpg on Mar 9, 2010 17:30:48 GMT -5
He's right. It was a ludicrous way to debut arguably the hottest free agent available. I can understand that they want to get Sting over as a heel, but there are countless people to feed to him. I can understand that they want to save his first real match, but there are ways to do that without a protracted beat-down to introduce him to the company. It was just a bad call. Who else could he whallop in TNA to get over as a heel?
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Post by GaTechGrad on Mar 9, 2010 17:35:13 GMT -5
He gets a win over one of the biggest icons in wrestling... yeah, poor RVD
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