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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jun 6, 2020 11:52:33 GMT -5
Lio has been pretty up front about how he saw it and psychoanalyzing how no he's actually totally trying to subtly key people to him thinking they're racists is not a road you want to go down due. This email is one of a line of things Lio has said about the topic that at no point included "They're all racists". It was a bad look and he said it made him uncomfortable. You don't get to tell people they can't be uncomfortable, full stop. Fair enough. He can feel how he feels about it, and I can feel like he's being illogical (again, considering the % of minorities on the roster, rookies will be grunting for whites, blacks, Asians, Latinos, etc.) and framed it in a way to imply something more insidious was going on. I'm sure I'll be asked to drop it soon. Lio Rush playing the long game by dropping two words in a multi-paragraph email to his superiors so that one day when he puts it out on social media a year later and when the story's already widely known people will call WWE racist. Smartest man in wrestling.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 6, 2020 12:02:01 GMT -5
So quick question, and I'm saying this as the white guy in my avatar... Who are we to tell a black guy how to interpret something that, understandably, can be seen that way regardless of the history behind it? Because especially on this page, that seems WAY more glaring than the act itself. He can feel however he wants. I'm weighing in with my opinion here. If you think it's irrelevant because I'm white, cool. If you think I'm straight full of shit, cool. It’s not that it’s irrelevant, you’re not seeing it from his perspective. Young black man, probably has dealt with a lot of shit to get to this point, works on the indies for years making his name, gets signed to what he hopes is the last contract of his career...then has to start again by doing stuff he was probably mocked about doing when he was younger for his skin color? Like, outside of the whole “locker room morale” stuff...how else is he supposed to take that?
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by The Ichi on Jun 6, 2020 12:04:09 GMT -5
Setting up/taking down rings(which Lio said that he happily did in NXT), getting props ready for the show, setting up the announce table, putting stuff under the ring are all things that I’m fine with the young guys doing, as the vets definitely shouldn’t be doing those things. Carrying another man’s personal belongings doesn’t fall under that category. I’m carrying mine, you can carry yours. This is pretty much where I stand. Getting the new guys to contribute to the actual job part of the job to get a feel for their strengths/weaknesses is fine, and part of just about any other job. The "hey man, it's expected for new guys to do things for me that I'm perfectly capable of doing myself and have no baring on your actual work?" No. And this needs to be said, it "being around for decades" as a defense? Think long and hard about that.
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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 6, 2020 12:06:17 GMT -5
Hazing still going on?
Such carny bastards.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 6, 2020 12:10:38 GMT -5
Should also say, I’ve helped set up and put down rings, given water to people when needed, put down and up chairs, asked if there was anything I could do...at shows.
Even at training, if someone was too worn out and I could get something for them, I would since that’s the guy I am.
You ask me to carry your bag outside of that if you’re capable of doing so because you’re in the business longer? Nah, not doing that. That’s BS and doesn’t prove anything except you need to keep your ego in check.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by The Ichi on Jun 6, 2020 12:15:29 GMT -5
Also it's weird nobody has brought up the part with them making up a rumour about his fiance even though he had video evidence of it being bullshit. These are the people acting reasonable and just like any job, to some of you.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 12:39:03 GMT -5
Fair enough. He can feel how he feels about it, and I can feel like he's being illogical (again, considering the % of minorities on the roster, rookies will be grunting for whites, blacks, Asians, Latinos, etc.) and framed it in a way to imply something more insidious was going on. I'm sure I'll be asked to drop it soon. Lio Rush playing the long game by dropping two words in a multi-paragraph email to his superiors so that one day when he puts it out on social media a year later and when the story's already widely known people will call WWE racist. Smartest man in wrestling. Lio Rushing calling it "racially insensitive" to perform the same tasks done by wrestlers of varying races for wrestlers of varying races. When Lio, Swerve, Apollo and Woods are exclusively hauling bags for Dolph, Bryan, Braun and Orton, let me know.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 12:40:23 GMT -5
He can feel however he wants. I'm weighing in with my opinion here. If you think it's irrelevant because I'm white, cool. If you think I'm straight full of shit, cool. It’s not that it’s irrelevant, you’re not seeing it from his perspective. Young black man, probably has dealt with a lot of shit to get to this point, works on the indies for years making his name, gets signed to what he hopes is the last contract of his career...then has to start again by doing stuff he was probably mocked about doing when he was younger for his skin color? Like, outside of the whole “locker room morale” stuff...how else is he supposed to take that? I am. And I still think he's wrong.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jun 6, 2020 12:43:23 GMT -5
It’s not that it’s irrelevant, you’re not seeing it from his perspective. Young black man, probably has dealt with a lot of shit to get to this point, works on the indies for years making his name, gets signed to what he hopes is the last contract of his career...then has to start again by doing stuff he was probably mocked about doing when he was younger for his skin color? Like, outside of the whole “locker room morale” stuff...how else is he supposed to take that? I am. And I still think he's wrong. That’s fine, but you didn’t answer my question.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Jun 6, 2020 12:43:36 GMT -5
Maybe not the best of times (not there has ever been a good time) to tell young black men how they should feel about racial issues...
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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 6, 2020 12:46:38 GMT -5
Asking a black guy in Anerica to carry bags, especially for white people, will always have a racial undertone, even if not intended.
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Post by crowley1986 on Jun 6, 2020 12:46:54 GMT -5
Lio Rush playing the long game by dropping two words in a multi-paragraph email to his superiors so that one day when he puts it out on social media a year later and when the story's already widely known people will call WWE racist. Smartest man in wrestling. Lio Rushing calling it "racially insensitive" to perform the same tasks done by wrestlers of varying races for wrestlers of varying races. When Lio, Swerve, Apollo and Woods are exclusively hauling bags for Dolph, Bryan, Braun and Orton, let me know. Alister Black did it for a while when he got promoted to main roster and Roman told him to eventually stop Same timeframe as Lio, Maverick and AOP were doing the helping out - giving water, helping out....as when i was part of sport teams when i was younger, the younger/newer members helped with dishing out drinks, carrying medical/uniform, cleaning up, leaving senior ones first in shower etc and then the next batch of new members take over....the only thing i dont agree with is the buying beers/food stuff as more than likely theyre earning less
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jun 6, 2020 12:46:54 GMT -5
Lio Rush playing the long game by dropping two words in a multi-paragraph email to his superiors so that one day when he puts it out on social media a year later and when the story's already widely known people will call WWE racist. Smartest man in wrestling. Lio Rushing calling it "racially insensitive" to perform the same tasks done by wrestlers of varying races for wrestlers of varying races. When Lio, Swerve, Apollo and Woods are exclusively hauling bags for Dolph, Bryan, Braun and Orton, let me know. "I believe we are all able to carry our own gear and provisions. I treat others as equals and as a young black male have often had to fight for my own equality." This is what he said about it at first. The inception of this whole controversy. Just because other black people carried bags doesn't mean his life and his experiences didn't shape it differently and it doesn't mean he's not being sincere in seeing it through a lens where he's uncomfortable with the idea. It doesn't mean he hasn't in the past been made to perform tasks like this because of his race that make this situatino bring those feelings back and recall discrimination he's experienced. It doesn't mean he doesn't see the mental image of himself carrying another man's bags and not feel like it's an unsavory look. Or how about what he said to go along with this email posting: "Please be clear, I am in no way insinuating that the WWE is a racist company, nor am I commenting on the racial attitudes of any of the companies individuals," Rush continued. "However, this email shows that I expressed concerns of racial insensitivity and my feelings as a young African American male to the WWE office during the incidents that have brought so much negativity to my name." You're saying you see it his way and think he's making this up and trying to dogwhistle. I don't think you are seeing it his way. I think you're trying to read this as him saying it's racist and dissecting an argument he's not talking about.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by The Ichi on Jun 6, 2020 12:50:30 GMT -5
Bare in mind we're only getting his account in words. If he felt a racial vibe from his time there, it's not our place to say he's wrong for feeling that way.
And again, the stuff with his fiance. That's scummy to the max. Why isn't it being talked about?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 12:51:13 GMT -5
I am. And I still think he's wrong. That’s fine, but you didn’t answer my question. Perhaps look around at the POC veterans having their bags carried by the rookie grunts and at the white rookies carrying them and asking himself if there's actually any racial bias involved. If we're going to talk having perspective and all.
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Nr1Humanoid
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Jun 6, 2020 12:51:28 GMT -5
He never claimed racism, only racially insensitivity.
In any country, with slavery in its history, it should not be hard to realise telling a black man to do your menial shit will not be favorably received.
Oh and, you really learn a lot about people with posts in thread such as this.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Jun 6, 2020 12:51:37 GMT -5
Bare in mind we're only getting his account in words. If he felt a racial vibe from his time there, it's not our place to say he's wrong for feeling that way. And again, the stuff with his fiance. That's scummy to the max. Why isn't it being talked about? I don't know a damn thing about the fiance story. Bulletpoints?
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Jun 6, 2020 12:56:24 GMT -5
Man, of all the times to claim a black person has no merit to their claims of racial insensitivity and firmly shut down the idea with added implication he's intentionally lying to make the company look bad, this is a real yikes of a week for that.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,396
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Post by The Ichi on Jun 6, 2020 13:08:47 GMT -5
Bare in mind we're only getting his account in words. If he felt a racial vibe from his time there, it's not our place to say he's wrong for feeling that way. And again, the stuff with his fiance. That's scummy to the max. Why isn't it being talked about? I don't know a damn thing about the fiance story. Bulletpoints? It's in the OP. Basically after several times being reprimanded, one of the same aggravators approached him and told him he needs to fall in line and that there are rumours that his fiance was trying to sneak into the female locker room even though the security that had all the footage shows nothing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 13:19:15 GMT -5
Man, of all the times to claim a black person has no merit to their claims of racial insensitivity and firmly shut down the idea with added implication he's intentionally lying to make the company look bad, this is a real yikes of a week for that. Where is the f***ing racial insensitivity in being tasked to do the EXACT SAME THING as your peers. Jesus f***ing Christ. I'm not talking about anything else in the company, I'm talking about THIS SPECIFIC rookie hauling shit thing. We're at "POC says there was racial insensitivity, shut up and don't question anything". Okay. That's trash.
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