|
Post by oxbaker on May 16, 2022 9:32:46 GMT -5
I'm here for the BCC with Danielson and Moxley if only because it gives them something to do while they're out of the title picture. I don't think you can have wrestlers the caliber of Danielson and Mox remain as single guys without sooner or later, making them both title challengers. Especially in the case of Mox, who hasn't really been near the title since the angle with Omega immediately after losing the belt. BCC lets them both be strong badasses that keep on winning and they're getting others over in the process. It'll only take one promo or a couple of singles wins to put either of them straight back in the world title hunt if they're needed. Plus, Regal just has that air of knowledge and credibility as a coach for anyone. Danielson is a student of the game who's going to be eager to learn all that he can about wrestling, whereas Mox is always happy to learn more ways to hurt people. Regal is believable as both the master technician Danielson looks up to, and the sadistic hard bastard that still has things to teach Mox. Well within AEW’s rankings structure you can absolutely keep them as singles and not have them become title challengers until you’re ready. You just let them put someone over occasionally so they never quite rise high enough in the rankings until you are ready to pull that trigger. AEW to me sometimes seems overly obsessed with ‘protecting’ everyone. Guess what: Mox doesn’t need protection. He can lose a match here and there (helping make someone else, particularly a younger guy) and is still 100% viable as a title contender when you put him on a streak. Same for BD. Doesn’t always have to be a ‘make him look strong’ screwy finish or ‘yeah guy lost but look how good he lost’ type thing. Adds a bit of unpredictability to cards so you don’t look at who’s wrestling on Wednesday and say ‘OK, I know who won’ before it starts. Omega lost to Pac and CIMA and I think a couple of others in the early AEW days, right? Did it make people lose interest in him? Did it make him not a viable champion when that time came? The top guys losing should be a big deal and storylines can be built around it. You can use that to say ‘in AEW, this roster is so stacked that everybody better be on alert every match because even a Mox or Danielson can be taken down.’ That’s a good thing.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 9:56:29 GMT -5
Bryan is leaps and bounds a bigger star than Regal both in reality and kayfabe so Regal saying glowing things doesn’t put him over huge. Moxley and Bryan are two of my favorites, but adding Regal and Yuta makes it a situation where it seems the whole is definitely not better than the sum of its parts. Maybe they’ll change my mind in the months to come For me I just don't agree, the idea of BCC is compelling shit to me, and Regal and Jericho having a confrontation is maybe the thing I'm looking forward to most this week on Dynamite at least promo wise. The Road to promo by Regal may have also literally been promo of the year outside of MJF using the "I'm a Snake" line against Punk, shit's been firing on all cylinders for me as far as I'm concerned right now, and it's only just started so I wanna see where it goes. Realistically speaking, Mox was in a tough place. He's too big of a star to NOT go for the title as a solo act, but he'd done all there was to do as a face, and there was no way in hell anyone would buy him as a heel given the real-life things surrounding his departure and return. Danielson definitely has/had plenty of juice as a single's competitor, I'll grant anyone that, but he's also the kind of guy who knows that he's the Regal of his generation, so to speak, so a stable that can grow and get talent over just by association is something he's going to do no questions asked. If you don't think it's working, look at how Wheeler Yuta went from "The guy who eats pins in the Best Friends" to one of the most over young talents they have. Just by virtue of being the Regal/Mox/Danielson seal of approval. I say all of this because I understand why people don't like how BCC has taken Bryan away from the title picture, or as a singles competitor, or whatever.. but I also understand why they did it. And it's not like he couldn't just decide to challenge for the title tomorrow while still being part of BCC, either.
|
|
|
Post by polarbearpete on May 16, 2022 10:02:23 GMT -5
For me I just don't agree, the idea of BCC is compelling shit to me, and Regal and Jericho having a confrontation is maybe the thing I'm looking forward to most this week on Dynamite at least promo wise. The Road to promo by Regal may have also literally been promo of the year outside of MJF using the "I'm a Snake" line against Punk, shit's been firing on all cylinders for me as far as I'm concerned right now, and it's only just started so I wanna see where it goes. Realistically speaking, Mox was in a tough place. He's too big of a star to NOT go for the title as a solo act, but he'd done all there was to do as a face, and there was no way in hell anyone would buy him as a heel given the real-life things surrounding his departure and return. Danielson definitely has/had plenty of juice as a single's competitor, I'll grant anyone that, but he's also the kind of guy who knows that he's the Regal of his generation, so to speak, so a stable that can grow and get talent over just by association is something he's going to do no questions asked. If you don't think it's working, look at how Wheeler Yuta went from "The guy who eats pins in the Best Friends" to one of the most over young talents they have. Just by virtue of being the Regal/Mox/Danielson seal of approval. I say all of this because I understand why people don't like how BCC has taken Bryan away from the title picture, or as a singles competitor, or whatever.. but I also understand why they did it. And it's not like he couldn't just decide to challenge for the title tomorrow while still being part of BCC, either. For me, it’s more that the Bryan segments and Mox segments each week as solo acts were some of the best and most entertaining segments to look forward to. And now instead of that, they’re put together in a meh segment each week (outside of the great Yuta match). I’m sure they could turn it around, and maybe a two on two feud with the Bucks or someone like that would get me more invested.
|
|
asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,770
Member is Online
|
Post by asuka007 on May 16, 2022 10:32:07 GMT -5
In theory this is where the TNT Title could be useful. But instead it’s wrapped up in the worst feud AEW has ever done (imo).
|
|
|
Post by oxbaker on May 16, 2022 11:04:53 GMT -5
In theory this is where the TNT Title could be useful. But instead it’s wrapped up in the worst feud AEW has ever done (imo). I’d like someone who thinks they have a grasp on this to explain the thought process behind the Sky/Sammy ‘Neverending story’ double-turn into another double-turn booking. My best guess is Tony had the Sammy/Tay roles planned for Cody and Brandy and wanted to show the world what could have happened if Cody had stayed, how he could make him into a great heel with this angle and … well, nobody seems to be into it nor understands what it’s trying to accomplish. I’ve had my criticisms of AEW and not everything on the show is for me (I get OC but he doesn’t appeal to me, same to a lesser degree with Danhausen but at least he makes me smile sometimes and I’m willing to see how it plays out), but Sammy/Tay is the first AEW act that has 100% go-away heat from me. When they come on, I switch the channel to see what’s going on with the NBA or NHL playoffs.
|
|
markymark
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,389
|
Post by markymark on May 16, 2022 11:15:50 GMT -5
The Nightmare Collective is still the worst feud in AEW history because they were always met with pure silence, and thats worse than Sammy/Tay go away heat.
|
|
JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 40,485
|
Post by JoDaNa1281 on May 16, 2022 11:55:37 GMT -5
At risk of beating a dead horse, the real sport comparison is extremely apt because I'd say it's a very striking minority of coaches or managers that were legitimately super special awesome as active players. More often than not, it always feels like your coaches and managers were journeymen or utility guys or guys that weren't necessarily the top of the card so to speak. That tends to translate well to coaching and teaching, since they had to learn all the tricks and scrap to hold themselves up versus folks who were able to cruise on innate talent or size or what have you. I've also heard a lot of the inverse about how guys who were freakishly talented as players tend to be lousy coaches because they're like "well just... do it" or otherwise can't grasp that other players just might not be able to do things or look at things the same ways that they do. To bring it back to wrestling, I feel like that's almost certainly why a lot of your better regarded trainers and such ARE people like Curt Hawkins and Gangrel that may have had their moments in the spotlight but certainly weren't world champions. And really, of the more recent wrestling generations, at least on the US side, who's a former world champion that's an active trainer/has an active wrestling school that's actually put out multiple competitors that's decently well regarded? All I can think of is HBK and Booker T, and all I can think of regarding HBK is how allegedly hands-off he actually was/is with his wrestling school. Exactly why you should never overlook people like Brian Myers. Even if they spent a lot of their career as a jobber, they still worked with top people & have a wealth of knowledge to give.
|
|
lucas_lee
Hank Scorpio
Heel turn is finished, now stripping away my personality
Posts: 6,739
Member is Online
|
Post by lucas_lee on May 16, 2022 13:57:47 GMT -5
At risk of beating a dead horse, the real sport comparison is extremely apt because I'd say it's a very striking minority of coaches or managers that were legitimately super special awesome as active players. More often than not, it always feels like your coaches and managers were journeymen or utility guys or guys that weren't necessarily the top of the card so to speak. That tends to translate well to coaching and teaching, since they had to learn all the tricks and scrap to hold themselves up versus folks who were able to cruise on innate talent or size or what have you. I've also heard a lot of the inverse about how guys who were freakishly talented as players tend to be lousy coaches because they're like "well just... do it" or otherwise can't grasp that other players just might not be able to do things or look at things the same ways that they do. To bring it back to wrestling, I feel like that's almost certainly why a lot of your better regarded trainers and such ARE people like Curt Hawkins and Gangrel that may have had their moments in the spotlight but certainly weren't world champions. And really, of the more recent wrestling generations, at least on the US side, who's a former world champion that's an active trainer/has an active wrestling school that's actually put out multiple competitors that's decently well regarded? All I can think of is HBK and Booker T, and all I can think of regarding HBK is how allegedly hands-off he actually was/is with his wrestling school. Exactly why you should never overlook people like Brian Myers. Even if they spent a lot of their career as a jobber, they still worked with top people & have a wealth of knowledge to give. Hell heres an even better example of someone like that: Mr.Hughes if you look at the diverse list of wrestlers he's trained, it reads like a whos who of the indy scene and some mainstream wrestlers
|
|
|
Post by Cyno on May 16, 2022 14:17:24 GMT -5
Lance Storm is one of the most respected names in the business and he didn't exactly have WrestleMania main events.
|
|
lucas_lee
Hank Scorpio
Heel turn is finished, now stripping away my personality
Posts: 6,739
Member is Online
|
Post by lucas_lee on May 16, 2022 14:25:07 GMT -5
Lance Storm is one of the most respected names in the business and he didn't exactly have WrestleMania main events. Very true but I think people would expect him to train people because of fluidity and crispness in the ring. Guys like Hawkins and such aren't really expected.
|
|
|
Post by eJm on May 16, 2022 15:05:02 GMT -5
Lance Storm is one of the most respected names in the business and he didn't exactly have WrestleMania main events. Very true but I think people would expect him to train people because of fluidity and crispness in the ring. Guys like Hawkins and such aren't really expected. Yeah, pretty much. Like, we're laboring the point but overall...if Brian Myers trained practically half the AEW roster and Mr Hughes trained a good chunk of the NXT one, of course it's believable Danielson and Moxley would want further training from William Regal of all people.
|
|
markymark
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,389
|
Post by markymark on May 16, 2022 15:09:54 GMT -5
Posting this because I feel it fits perfectly with the subject of this thread
|
|
|
Post by Lizuka #BLM on May 17, 2022 2:46:36 GMT -5
If I'm picking a worst feud in AEW history I'm going to go with the Nightmare Family / Factory thing. It just dragged on and on for an excruciatingly long period of time, it was blatantly recycling a ton of plot points from other Cody feuds, at no point was the Factory ever actually depicted as even slightly being an actual threat in a head-to-head fight, it gave us the Cody / Ogogo stuff that pretty much snowballed into Cody leaving the company, and for being supposedly about spotlighting some of their top prospects they did pretty much nothing but get their asses kicked at every turn. Like oh wow, look at how big and scary Nick Comoroto is having him even with multiple run-ins get decisively crushed by Dustin Rhodes, what a rub.
|
|
clifford
King Koopa
Shingo Takagi stan
Posts: 10,683
|
Post by clifford on May 17, 2022 8:30:33 GMT -5
I think AEW's booking has slipped a bit, but its still the best booked company in America (and maybe the world cause New Japan has fallen off quite a bit in the last couple years).
They've had to deal with an unprecedented influx of world class talent, and try and find a way to integrate them into factions, feuds and storylines in a way that quite frankly, given the amount of talent they've signed and the limited tv time per week they have, was always going to be an impossible task. They've done very well, but there's been (understandable) mis steps and shortcomings.
Juggling the established AEW stars, the up and coming stars, and the new stars from WWE and elsewhere is a good headache to have, but its still a headache. The dust is still settling from all these debuts, and probably will be for another few months.
Going from the very self-contained and straight forward Dynamites of Daily's Place to constant touring and booking for the live crowds as well as the tv audience is another adjustment that I don't think is really thought of or mentioned, but it also brought its own challenge.
Basically, I think they've done pretty much the best they could with everything- there's a hell of a lot of room for improvement but they hit more than they miss.
|
|
|
Post by lavelleuk22 on May 17, 2022 9:27:10 GMT -5
It's funny this thread was made this week as I thought the last dynamite was the best since the last PPV because there seemed to be more stories and more intriguing booking
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 17, 2022 9:33:08 GMT -5
I think AEW's booking has slipped a bit, but its still the best booked company in America (and maybe the world cause New Japan has fallen off quite a bit in the last couple years). Honestly, I think that a lot of the criticism AEW draws is because of how much it draws from NJPW's style of booking. AEW certainly has drawn a lot of its inspiration from NJPW - i.e. almost everyone is in a faction, there's generally always a "challenger wants the honor and prestige of being the champion" feud at the top of the card, and stories are frequently moved forward by press conferences (in the form of Tony Schiavone interviews in AEW). I've watched NJPW pretty closely now for almost a decade, and I've always kind of felt that its booking tends to be absolutely phenomenal as major shows approach, but kind of ebbs and flows between. You get a lot of 8-man tags with 2 young lions and 6 vets who aren't even gonna bother to take their T-Shirts off in NJPW in the interregnum period between major shows, and it's always been that way. I love AEW. I really don't find its booking to be too bad at the moment, but we are getting a heavy dose of "Konosuke Takeshita is facing Hangman...that's a cool match" at the moment. YMMV on that kind of booking, and AEW does it a lot on week-to-week TV, particularly now given that AEW has such a wealth of talent at its disposal. I do understand the criticism that so many matches seem to happen on AEW television just for the sake of happening, without any real stakes. I don't personally mind it, but I get why people do. But, I do expect that, as we ramp up towards Double or Nothing, the booking is going to get a lot more exciting, as the MJF/Wardlow story reaches its denouement, the Jokers are revealed, the tag title triple feud starts to actually take shape, the JAS/BCC feud starts to flesh out more, etc...
|
|
Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,294
|
Post by Fade on May 17, 2022 10:09:01 GMT -5
I think AEW's booking has slipped a bit, but its still the best booked company in America (and maybe the world cause New Japan has fallen off quite a bit in the last couple years). Honestly, I think that a lot of the criticism AEW draws is because of how much it draws from NJPW's style of booking. AEW certainly has drawn a lot of its inspiration from NJPW - i.e. almost everyone is in a faction, there's generally always a "challenger wants the honor and prestige of being the champion" feud at the top of the card, and stories are frequently moved forward by press conferences (in the form of Tony Schiavone interviews in AEW). I've watched NJPW pretty closely now for almost a decade, and I've always kind of felt that its booking tends to be absolutely phenomenal as major shows approach, but kind of ebbs and flows between. You get a lot of 8-man tags with 2 young lions and 6 vets who aren't even gonna bother to take their T-Shirts off in NJPW in the interregnum period between major shows, and it's always been that way. I love AEW. I really don't find its booking to be too bad at the moment, but we are getting a heavy dose of "Konosuke Takeshita is facing Hangman...that's a cool match" at the moment. YMMV on that kind of booking, and AEW does it a lot on week-to-week TV, particularly now given that AEW has such a wealth of talent at its disposal. I do understand the criticism that so many matches seem to happen on AEW television just for the sake of happening, without any real stakes. I don't personally mind it, but I get why people do. But, I do expect that, as we ramp up towards Double or Nothing, the booking is going to get a lot more exciting, as the MJF/Wardlow story reaches its denouement, the Jokers are revealed, the tag title triple feud starts to actually take shape, the JAS/BCC feud starts to flesh out more, etc... That’s absolutely something that’s been killing my enjoyment.
|
|
|
Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 17, 2022 12:13:43 GMT -5
I think the week to week factor does have some merit in how it is sort of downgraded. The show the first year was able to build compelling characters and make good TV with their cast
I think over the last year it’s been as much about “who shows up next” just as much as it has been about the titles or feuds. For a good while they have been living off nice surprises coming in at a frequent schedule but with each new person that does mess up other things
Seeing Swerve, Cole, Lee etc is fun but they aren’t really doing anything that is interesting for me
|
|
|
Post by kingoftheindies on May 17, 2022 13:27:15 GMT -5
I think the week to week factor does have some merit in how it is sort of downgraded. The show the first year was able to build compelling characters and make good TV with their cast I think over the last year it’s been as much about “who shows up next” just as much as it has been about the titles or feuds. For a good while they have been living off nice surprises coming in at a frequent schedule but with each new person that does mess up other things Seeing Swerve, Cole, Lee etc is fun but they aren’t really doing anything that is interesting for me With Cole and crew I think they started fine but Kenny being out longer than expected has caused them to put a lot on hold... which has been noticeable as they seem to now have Young Bucks and ReDRagon treading water. Cole to an extent to. I do wonder how much that does change what they wanted to do and how much things have pivoted
|
|
Facetious
King Koopa
ADAM COLE BAYBAY
Posts: 11,693
Member is Online
|
Post by Facetious on May 17, 2022 13:30:09 GMT -5
I think the week to week factor does have some merit in how it is sort of downgraded. The show the first year was able to build compelling characters and make good TV with their cast I think over the last year it’s been as much about “who shows up next” just as much as it has been about the titles or feuds. For a good while they have been living off nice surprises coming in at a frequent schedule but with each new person that does mess up other things Seeing Swerve, Cole, Lee etc is fun but they aren’t really doing anything that is interesting for me While I do enjoy the current format, I do agree things were more "focused" in the first year. The roster is so bloated right now and TK puts the pedal to the floor every Dynamite. Even my dad mentioned how he still enjoys Dynamite, it could use a little breather here and there.
|
|