salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 13,991
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Post by salz4life on Nov 20, 2023 13:47:31 GMT -5
I'm disappointed because I don't think this film deserved what it's getting (although the numbers don't lie, so I'm probably biased). It wasn't a bad movie, but it's taking the hit for the fanbase being down on the MCU. There is going to be a lot of pressure on Deadpool to deliver next year and then won't the first Sam Wilson-led Captain America be next? That will also have a lot of pressure on it as well as it is the 'new' Cap.
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Renslayer
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
every time i come around your city...
Posts: 16,610
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Post by Renslayer on Nov 20, 2023 16:47:08 GMT -5
Is there a good reason why the trades have it out for nia decosta?
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Post by The Spelunker! on Nov 20, 2023 17:28:30 GMT -5
Turns out bad plotting and a bunch of middling movies wasn’t the recipe for blockbuster success. Who’d have thought?
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Post by Rolent Tex on Nov 20, 2023 19:35:17 GMT -5
A big issue is that Phase 4 on didn’t have a clear goal it was building to until way too late. Phase 1 was building to Avengers, Phase 2 and 3 were building to Thanos. Phase 4 was building to?? And this is where I feel corporate interference came into play. I remember around the time of Endgame, Feige came out and said they weren’t calling it Phase 4 because they were treating it differently then what came before. It was supposed to be about world building and expanding, hence why there was no Avengers movie planned. The whole Multiverse Saga thing feels like it was thought up after the fact Stupid thing is that it was supposed to lead to Kang all along but barely any of the shows and movies involve that. The Infinity Stones were spread across everything from Cap 1 on once they decided they were in for the long haul. Out of all the shows and movies only Loki, Ant-Man 3, Spidey 3, Dr. Strange 2 and maybe Deadpool 3 are even tackling the multiverse head on…and not even all of those dealt with Kang.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Nov 20, 2023 20:41:07 GMT -5
I'm disappointed because I don't think this film deserved what it's getting (although the numbers don't lie, so I'm probably biased). It wasn't a bad movie, but it's taking the hit for the fanbase being down on the MCU. There is going to be a lot of pressure on Deadpool to deliver next year and then won't the first Sam Wilson-led Captain America be next? That will also have a lot of pressure on it as well as it is the 'new' Cap.Extensive reshoots too.
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Post by Savage Gambino on Nov 20, 2023 22:29:20 GMT -5
A big issue is that Phase 4 on didn’t have a clear goal it was building to until way too late. Phase 1 was building to Avengers, Phase 2 and 3 were building to Thanos. Phase 4 was building to?? And this is where I feel corporate interference came into play. I remember around the time of Endgame, Feige came out and said they weren’t calling it Phase 4 because they were treating it differently then what came before. It was supposed to be about world building and expanding, hence why there was no Avengers movie planned. The whole Multiverse Saga thing feels like it was thought up after the fact Stupid thing is that it was supposed to lead to Kang all along but barely any of the shows and movies involve that. The Infinity Stones were spread across everything from Cap 1 on once they decided they were in for the long haul. Out of all the shows and movies only Loki, Ant-Man 3, Spidey 3, Dr. Strange 2 and maybe Deadpool 3 are even tackling the multiverse head on…and not even all of those dealt with Kang. And of the ones that do deal with Kang, two of them quite permanently defeat his variants (He Who Remains in Loki S1 and Kang proper in Quantumania). I mean, what kind of storytelling is that?
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Post by Rolent Tex on Nov 20, 2023 22:37:57 GMT -5
Stupid thing is that it was supposed to lead to Kang all along but barely any of the shows and movies involve that. The Infinity Stones were spread across everything from Cap 1 on once they decided they were in for the long haul. Out of all the shows and movies only Loki, Ant-Man 3, Spidey 3, Dr. Strange 2 and maybe Deadpool 3 are even tackling the multiverse head on…and not even all of those dealt with Kang. And of the ones that do deal with Kang, two of them quite permanently defeat his variants (He Who Remains in Loki S1 and Kang proper in Quantumania). I mean, what kind of storytelling is that? The supposed ending to Quantumania before the stupid ass ending reshoots was so much better as positioning Kang as a major threat. Escaping the Quantum Realm to enact his revenge on the Council of Kangs for banishing him and stranding Scott and Hope in the QR. All that needed was for Kang to off Hank Pym in that movie or Kang Dynasty and he’s a bonafide threat.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
The Ultimate Arbiter of Right And Wrong
Spent half my life here, God help me
Posts: 15,072
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Nov 21, 2023 2:26:57 GMT -5
And of the ones that do deal with Kang, two of them quite permanently defeat his variants (He Who Remains in Loki S1 and Kang proper in Quantumania). I mean, what kind of storytelling is that? The supposed ending to Quantumania before the stupid ass ending reshoots was so much better as positioning Kang as a major threat. Escaping the Quantum Realm to enact his revenge on the Council of Kangs for banishing him and stranding Scott and Hope in the QR. All that needed was for Kang to off Hank Pym in that movie or Kang Dynasty and he’s a bonafide threat. I can understand not stranding Scott and Hope since they've already done that. But at least have Kang get away and now be loose.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Nov 21, 2023 2:43:47 GMT -5
I don’t really know how much Quantumania being better would’ve actually helped build intrigue given the movie flopped anyway and Ant-Man was kind of always the C-tier of the MCU.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Nov 21, 2023 2:59:39 GMT -5
I can understand not stranding Scott and Hope since they've already done that. But at least have Kang get away and now be loose. Even the problem with that is you've just had the guy who's supposed to be a threat to all the Avengers at once job to the comic relief member of the team. Thanos was protected. We saw a little bit of him here and there, but the first time we actually saw him do anything substantial he pummels Hulk half to death in 30 seconds, murders Heimdall, and kills Loki with his bare hands. With Kang the threat is that there's an infinite amount of him. Kill one, there's an even more dangerous one who'll take his place. The real drawback with that sort of storytelling is once the heroes have seen off two or three of them it's hard to buy any of the ones that follow as a threat. I think the best way to proceed is to have various Kangs get a few wins under their belts. Have a Kang kill the Earth-838 heroes. Have a Kang kill the Foxverse (or Foxverse-adjacent) heroes and villains. Have a Kang destroy the TVA and f*** Loki up. Then have a Kang kill those Kangs in Kang Dynasty, setting up the primary Kang for Secret Wars.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Nov 21, 2023 3:58:36 GMT -5
I can understand not stranding Scott and Hope since they've already done that. But at least have Kang get away and now be loose. Even the problem with that is you've just had the guy who's supposed to be a threat to all the Avengers at once job to the comic relief member of the team. Thanos was protected. We saw a little bit of him here and there, but the first time we actually saw him do anything substantial he pummels Hulk half to death in 30 seconds, murders Heimdall, and kills Loki with his bare hands. With Kang the threat is that there's an infinite amount of him. Kill one, there's an even more dangerous one who'll take his place. The real drawback with that sort of storytelling is once the heroes have seen off two or three of them it's hard to buy any of the ones that follow as a threat. I think the best way to proceed is to have various Kangs get a few wins under their belts. Have a Kang kill the Earth-838 heroes. Have a Kang kill the Foxverse (or Foxverse-adjacent) heroes and villains. Have a Kang destroy the TVA and f*** Loki up. Then have a Kang kill those Kangs in Kang Dynasty, setting up the primary Kang for Secret Wars. And they already demonstrated why that's a bad storytelling plan because Age of Ultron consisted entirely of him getting his ass kicked over and over and over (and also that boring ass farm scene that never ended) and it sucked. For that matter on that note I do think it was a major structural mistake having the Thanos we actually followed and saw as a character get abruptly killed off at the start of Endgame with little effort then trying to position a different one as the actual final boss.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
The Ultimate Arbiter of Right And Wrong
Spent half my life here, God help me
Posts: 15,072
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Nov 21, 2023 4:38:14 GMT -5
I can understand not stranding Scott and Hope since they've already done that. But at least have Kang get away and now be loose. Even the problem with that is you've just had the guy who's supposed to be a threat to all the Avengers at once job to the comic relief member of the team. Thanos was protected. We saw a little bit of him here and there, but the first time we actually saw him do anything substantial he pummels Hulk half to death in 30 seconds, murders Heimdall, and kills Loki with his bare hands. With Kang the threat is that there's an infinite amount of him. Kill one, there's an even more dangerous one who'll take his place. The real drawback with that sort of storytelling is once the heroes have seen off two or three of them it's hard to buy any of the ones that follow as a threat. I think the best way to proceed is to have various Kangs get a few wins under their belts. Have a Kang kill the Earth-838 heroes. Have a Kang kill the Foxverse (or Foxverse-adjacent) heroes and villains. Have a Kang destroy the TVA and f*** Loki up. Then have a Kang kill those Kangs in Kang Dynasty, setting up the primary Kang for Secret Wars. You can always book it as an "escape was his REAL plan, he gives no shits about Ant-Man." There are ways to give Scott a flukey half victory, the victory is that he survived at all etc. Straight up killing the one who's meant to be the most dangerous one cuts all that off.
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Post by Rolent Tex on Nov 21, 2023 7:31:44 GMT -5
The supposed ending to Quantumania before the stupid ass ending reshoots was so much better as positioning Kang as a major threat. Escaping the Quantum Realm to enact his revenge on the Council of Kangs for banishing him and stranding Scott and Hope in the QR. All that needed was for Kang to off Hank Pym in that movie or Kang Dynasty and he’s a bonafide threat. I can understand not stranding Scott and Hope since they've already done that. But at least have Kang get away and now be loose. That’s the first thing I thought when I heard that part….”again???”. Kang needed a big win though. This is a guy that’s killed Avengers.
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Nov 21, 2023 10:09:40 GMT -5
Nothing to add but I'm so detached from the MCU and Marvel at the minute that this release was a surprise.
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,866
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Post by chrom on Nov 21, 2023 11:43:21 GMT -5
Kang's suppose to be a universal level threat but so far he's about as threatening as Justin Hammer.
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Post by Citizen Snips Has Left on Nov 21, 2023 12:45:14 GMT -5
Getting back on topic to The Marvels, I feel like no one really acknowledged that Evil Kree Girl’s villainous plot was pretty much the same one used in Spaceballs.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Nov 21, 2023 13:23:58 GMT -5
Getting back on topic to The Marvels, I feel like no one really acknowledged that Evil Kree Girl’s villainous plot was pretty much the same one used in Spaceballs. Maybe not here in the thread, but I swear every review I read referenced Spaceballs
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Post by "Cane Dewey" Johnson on Nov 21, 2023 16:07:00 GMT -5
Kang's suppose to be a universal level threat but so far he's about as threatening as Justin Hammer. Justin Hammer becomes the new Kang.
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Post by Andee9001 on Nov 21, 2023 19:06:49 GMT -5
For what it's worth i thought it was a fine and fun movie. Nothing amazing or groundbreaking but decent enough. But i think that's another part of the problem.
I spent about $35nz on tickets and food. Fine for me because i can budget for it and i wanted to see it. If i had read reviews beforehand saying it was decent but nothing amazing i doubt it would have put me off. For someone who money is a bit tight for and might be on the fence will they spend the money now or wait a few months until it goes onto Disney+?
I think as long as Disney+ exists they need to be putting out the best films possible that need to be must see. They simply can't be middle of the road anymore when you have a much cheaper alternative.
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Post by Non Banjoble Tokens on Nov 22, 2023 2:52:59 GMT -5
I want the new threat to the Marvel Universe to just be some random guy named Larry.
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