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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Feb 22, 2007 18:47:16 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2007 18:48:32 GMT -5
There you go. Just ask PAT PATTERSON. |
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Post by Cousin Judge on Feb 22, 2007 18:49:03 GMT -5
But this whole "younger guys" bullcrap....wrestling is a business and while it's important to create new superstars you HAVE to cash in on the one's you have. If we turn it into a conveyorbelt and keep pushing guys on basis of age rather than talent or appeal then the industry would die within 10 years. It doesn't have to a conveyor belt. No, hogan can put a young guy over once in a while. When it's right I'm sure he would. But what did Vince have in store for Orton? He was jobbing to Carlito for the immediately after. You'd have imagined that when Vince pitched the idea of orton going over Hogan asked what his long term plans with Orton were and be honest, given what they were would you have jobbed for him if you were Hogan? We all know that Hogan can give a rub and we all know that Foley can't and we all know the reason for this. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2007 18:50:33 GMT -5
It doesn't have to a conveyor belt. No, hogan can put a young guy over once in a while. When it's right I'm sure he would. But what did Vince have in store for Orton? He was jobbing to Carlito for the immediately after. You'd have imagined that when Vince pitched the idea of orton going over Hogan asked what his long term plans with Orton were and be honest, given what they were would you have jobbed for him if you were Hogan? We all know that Hogan can give a rub and we all know that Foley can't and we all know the reason for this. No, I would have jobbed if I were Hogan. But that's because I'm not a crusty, washed-up politician. |
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Post by MGH on Feb 22, 2007 18:52:20 GMT -5
It doesn't have to a conveyor belt. No, hogan can put a young guy over once in a while. When it's right I'm sure he would. But what did Vince have in store for Orton? He was jobbing to Carlito for the immediately after. You'd have imagined that when Vince pitched the idea of orton going over Hogan asked what his long term plans with Orton were and be honest, given what they were would you have jobbed for him if you were Hogan? We all know that Hogan can give a rub and we all know that Foley can't and we all know the reason for this. You also have to take in to account that had Orton beaten Hogan, or I should say had Hogan ALLOWED Orton to beat him, that those Carlito plans could have drastically changed. |
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Post by molson5 on Feb 22, 2007 18:55:12 GMT -5
I agree with both parties. Hogan's worth the money - check out the Summerslam buyrates for his matches with Orton and Michaels. He might STILL be the biggest draw in wrestling. But at some point, the short-term financial gains are worth it in the long hall.
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Post by Banned Member on Feb 22, 2007 18:56:21 GMT -5
Never. Adjust for inflation and you'll find that HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN drew more money than anyone. And that's not even including WCW where "Stinko" -- while putting on some good matches -- did little to draw fans. HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN has already challenged "Stinko" to a match. But "Stinko" is too much of a coward because he knows that if they wrestled each other HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN would out pop him and shatter "Stinko's" myth of popularity. I'm sorry all I saw was caps on what could of been a good answear. I ended up reading BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH. So I skipped your views once again. |
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Post by MGH on Feb 22, 2007 18:58:27 GMT -5
I probably shouldn't have made this thread. That guy will end up bumping this 15 times like he did the other Hogan threads  |
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Post by Cousin Judge on Feb 22, 2007 18:59:20 GMT -5
When it's right I'm sure he would. But what did Vince have in store for Orton? He was jobbing to Carlito for the immediately after. You'd have imagined that when Vince pitched the idea of orton going over Hogan asked what his long term plans with Orton were and be honest, given what they were would you have jobbed for him if you were Hogan? We all know that Hogan can give a rub and we all know that Foley can't and we all know the reason for this. You also have to take in to account that had Orton beaten Hogan, or I should say had Hogan ALLOWED Orton to beat him, that those Carlito plans could have drastically changed. How and why? If Vince wanted to use Hogan as a springboard for Orton then he'd have used it regardless. Instead the match was brushed over and Orton was ignored. It's just Vince trying to put younger guys over throwing as much crap at the wall and hope something sticks. I go back to the Foley example but it's an apt one. There's a guy who now people EXPECT to lose hence nobody really gives two craps about him or his feuds. Sure a stunt table being set on fire looks pretty but there's no drama to his matches. With Hogan people don't know if hes going over or if he's putting the other guy over and if they job Hogan out all the time he'd lose that. I understand the sophisticated "I don't want to see his old ass anymore" argument is by it's very nature resistant to reason but when you're in the business of MAKING MONEY you don't disregard the man who can arguably make far more than anyone else on the card in the right circumstance. |
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Post by The Boss on Feb 22, 2007 18:59:50 GMT -5
you got proof that when tickets went on sail, hogan's name was on the card? The WWF themselves were telling the media. The main focus from the beginning was who should face HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN. The original choice as they reported it was to have him face the Big Show to recreate the "Body Slam Heard 'Round the World". But of coarse injuries prevented that (although it's still possible that match could happen but not likely). Other potential opponents discussed were the Undertaker. Having HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN break his streak 20 years after breaking Andre the Giant's streak. Ric Flair was another potential opponent, to have the to top legends in the world today fight it out one last time. If done right that last one could have worked. They could talk about how this was the greatest feud of all time showing clips of the two men facing various opponents in the 80s and talking about how this was the most anticipated match in history. For over twenty years the debate has gone on... who is truly the greatest of all time HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN or Ric Flair? Now, on the biggest stage of them all, the debate will finally be settled! While a match between the two of them won't mean as much today as back then, their legacies do. It could be a match where both men put their legacies on the line. The loser must publicly admit that the other is and always has been the greatest. Fans of both HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN and Ric Flair would eat this match up. Sitting on the edge of their seats with the words "I told you so!" ready to be shouted at fans of the other. Then after wards the WWF could release a DVD dedicated solely to the HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN/Ric Flair feud starting from how they each dominated their respective promotion in the 80s while fans demanded that they fight. Then showing Flair's entrance to the WWF and then HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN'S arrival in WCW. Sorry I'm getting a little carried away here but I think that would be a great DVD. |
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Post by Banned Member on Feb 22, 2007 19:00:06 GMT -5
Yes me too, but I'm not annoyed I see it as a helpful piece of assistance, as soon as I see it I know I can keep on scrolling. But in any event this isn't Vince wanting to share the money out more fairly, he just wants to give Hogan less. You think he's going to go to the other performers on the card and say "Good news, I've secured you more money" Of course he's not. Hogan knows his worth and at his age and condition he's sticking to that religiously, and who can blame him. Sure Hogan's rich but if you were rich would you work for a BILLIONAIRE for free or less than you think you're worth? No of course you wouldn't, nor would I if I were in Hogan's position. To me this is about ego, I think the rot in Hogan/McMahon's relationship probably set in around the same time HHH woke up and thought "hey, Hogan gets bigger pops than me". I mean, who can forget the frankly embarrassing episode at Summerslam when HHH virtually spent 10 minutes trying to outpop him (and failing miserably amusingly enough) at Summerslam? Now suddenly Hogan's just "another guy". Since when? Look at these last two Summerslams where Hogan has been the top advertised draw for each show and the buyrates they did are fantastic. He is not just another "it guy" (what the hell does that mean anyway?) but rather THE it guy. However it will be Vince and not Hogan who will be embarrassed because of this. Just think about the venue, the occasion. I would guess a LOT of tickets for that event went to people wanting to a) see wrestlemania and b) see Hulk Hogan. If you went down to the line of people queueing up at the box office for tickets and asked them which performer they were most looking forward to seeing I bet most would have said Hogan. I bet there will be "We Want Hogan" chants as most people would have wanted to see Hogan there. They'll almost certainly crap all over the Lashley/Umaga thing and the Khali match as those are the two widely speculated that Hogan would participate in. So yeah, this isn't Vince standing up to the big bad Hogan, it's Vince trying to save money and convincing himself that he doesn't need who is probably the biggest individual reason for the majority of people to buy tickets to the event to be at Wrestlemania. Despite your lie of not reading my posts (makes no difference to me) you do make one hell of a point. Especially about fans expecting to see HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN at WrestleMania 23. When the tickets went on sale only one name was on the card: HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN. Even his opponent wasn't 100% yet. They said that they wanted to celebrate the 20th anniversary of the "body slam heard 'round the world". Tickets sold out in one hour on HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN'S name alone. A lot of fans are going to be angry. I love the CARD SUBJECT TO CHANGE ON THOSE TICKETS. |
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Feb 22, 2007 19:00:46 GMT -5
Hahaha!! what?!?!
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Post by Cousin Judge on Feb 22, 2007 19:02:29 GMT -5
Oh so you knew going into Summerslam 05 that Hogan was going over? Or did you know going into WM18 that Rock was going over? Or going into KOTR 2002 that Angle was going over? Hogan's history of winning/losing since 2002 hasn't been at all predictable apart from maybe the Orton/Hassan match |
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Feb 22, 2007 19:02:40 GMT -5
Hogan doesn't need the money. Good for Vince on not giving in. There isnt anything Hogan could come in and do that'll have people clammoring anymore. Sure, they get nostalgic to see him but they don't actually CARE what he does. And on the other side, it makes wrestling look even dumber that this old, immobile coot can come in and in his first match in like 2 years beats a 25 year old former world champ. That Orton feud was the biggest waxing debacle the WWE has done in a good while. I don't care if Hogan ever comes back. Agreed. I loathe Randy Orton but even I can admit that was total bullshit. Seriously, that feud failed to do anything for anyone(remember, one of the focal points was for the feud to help Brooke's doomed career.....so Brooked appeared all but twice on WWE tv and her video was met with obvious indifference from everyone). So, the result was an obviously injured Hogan going over Orton in an abortion of a match at Summerslam. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2007 19:03:33 GMT -5
Argument VS Hogan:
He inspired the worthlessness of turning John Cena into SuperCena, a "character" that 90% of the board has hated. Without all this stupid Hogan shit continuing past the 80's, maybe, just maybe, we'd have more competent people main eventing.
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Post by Next Level was WRONG on Feb 22, 2007 19:03:41 GMT -5
DANIEL RODIMER
.. ah crap.
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Post by Cousin Judge on Feb 22, 2007 19:04:00 GMT -5
Orton in an abortion of a match at Summerslam. You mean an abomination of a match, surely? |
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Feb 22, 2007 19:04:05 GMT -5
Oh so you knew going into Summerslam 05 that Hogan was going over? Or did you know going into WM18 that Rock was going over? Or going into KOTR 2002 that Angle was going over? Hogan's history of winning/losing since 2002 hasn't been at all predictable apart from maybe the Orton/Hassan match 60% of the time - Hogan's going over all the time. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2007 19:04:23 GMT -5
Hogan's history of winning/losing since 2002 hasn't been at all predictable apart from maybe the Orton/Hassan match  |
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Post by The Boss on Feb 22, 2007 19:04:27 GMT -5
Nay. Hogan could've put Orton over. I can't stand Orton, but it was the least hogan could do to put the dude over. Until Rated-RKO, Randy was in limbo. First of all HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN did put Orton over. Jobbing and putting someone over are diffarent things. Orton got more exposure from his match with HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN than in any other point in his career. Second, if he had beaten HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN the WWF would have had no choice but to continue the legend killer gimmick. Randy would be seen only fighting guys over fifty. Maybe Greg Gagne would be next. |
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