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Post by clashofchampains on Apr 26, 2011 13:56:48 GMT -5
Sad thing is Jay Lethal is a guy who needs TNA. Yeah he could get a decent run in WWE but his size will cap him in the mid card and upper mid card at best. Its sad to see Russo and TNA creative kill the guy because he to me was one of the TNA guys as much as Joe or AJ or anyone else to me at least. But as much as Jay Lethal needs TNA, TNA needs Jay Lethal. They could have used a unique talent like Lethal to establish their own brand and identity. The guy had some of the best mic skills since the end of the Monday Night Wars and was a very good in ring performer and to boot he is only 25. The guy was over when he got the big push almost a year ago and its sad to see him leave. Even his early work in the PCS and as Black Machismo was good and got over. Russo you killed yet another career or at least wasted a lot of its talent. The Jay Lethal career is almost a microcosm of TNA since Russo came in all the wasted potential, flawed philosophy, and failed repackagings and semi-pushes that weren't sustained is what TNA has been since 2006. I have never been more disappointed in the mishandling of a talent in a long time Lethal is one of my favorite talents I hope he goes to the WWE and at least gets a fair shake. Immitating people can only get you so far.
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Post by Wieners=$$$ on Apr 26, 2011 14:18:32 GMT -5
Sad thing is Jay Lethal is a guy who needs TNA. Yeah he could get a decent run in WWE but his size will cap him in the mid card and upper mid card at best. Its sad to see Russo and TNA creative kill the guy because he to me was one of the TNA guys as much as Joe or AJ or anyone else to me at least. But as much as Jay Lethal needs TNA, TNA needs Jay Lethal. They could have used a unique talent like Lethal to establish their own brand and identity. The guy had some of the best mic skills since the end of the Monday Night Wars and was a very good in ring performer and to boot he is only 25. The guy was over when he got the big push almost a year ago and its sad to see him leave. Even his early work in the PCS and as Black Machismo was good and got over. Russo you killed yet another career or at least wasted a lot of its talent. The Jay Lethal career is almost a microcosm of TNA since Russo came in all the wasted potential, flawed philosophy, and failed repackagings and semi-pushes that weren't sustained is what TNA has been since 2006. I have never been more disappointed in the mishandling of a talent in a long time Lethal is one of my favorite talents I hope he goes to the WWE and at least gets a fair shake. Immitating people can only get you so far. Agreed. The Ultimate Warrior is nowhere to be found, but then again there is a difference between giving someone a similar gimmick versus a tribute wrestler.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2011 14:22:11 GMT -5
Wow. Jay Lethal gets released by TNA and posters still find a way to blame and bash Hogan for the decision as if he had any say in it.
Since many of you seem to be so hip to TNA's finances, booking team, etc, can anyone actually tell me the structure of the company? Who is in charge? Who makes talent decisions? Who makes financial decisions? Who books the storylines? Other than the latter, which appears to be Russo by all indications, no one has a clue who is involved.
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Post by ritt works hard fo da chickens on Apr 26, 2011 22:51:04 GMT -5
Wow. Jay Lethal gets released by TNA and posters still find a way to blame and bash Hogan for the decision as if he had any say in it. Since many of you seem to be so hip to TNA's finances, booking team, etc, can anyone actually tell me the structure of the company? Who is in charge? Who makes talent decisions? Who makes financial decisions? Who books the storylines? Other than the latter, which appears to be Russo by all indications, no one has a clue who is involved. The only thing I saw Hogan get blamed for was not giving young guys a chance. The proof is in the pudding. Hogan, when he is in control, IE not ingratiating himself to Vince, doesn't frequently see anything in guys not from his generation or who aren't already established. He also doesn't get the appeal of wrestlers who are not larger than life. Before he even came in he said he thought TNA needed more super Heavyweights. It was previously a company sparse on regular heavy weights and heavy on cruiser/X-division. When Hogan arrived on the scene there was one X-division star everyone thought he would do an excellent program with. Even Hulks detractors thought there was one guy, one program that would amazing. It was too good to mess up. Hulk Hogan and Black Machismo, the guy who was a send up of Macho Man, who might have the most storied history with the Hulkster of all time. And Lethal was nowhere at first, pushed aside for the try outs of a slew of has beens and cronies. Then they finally pulled the trigger on it and it just flopped. Hogan didn't seem to into it. Not coincidentally I'd assume, Lethal was soon repackaged and sent to play off Flair. Hogan/Machismo flopping was WCW Invasion levels of missed oppurtunity.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2011 9:08:37 GMT -5
If I am recalling the events correctly, Hogan and Lethal had a backstage segment (where Lethal was pretending to be Savage) and that lead to Lethal being in segments with Bischoff in subsequent weeks. Eventually, Hogan got possession of Flair's HOF ring and ended up giving it to Lethal.......only for Lethal to give it right back to Flair. So the Hogan interaction LEAD TO the Lethal/Flair feud. When Lethal was transitioning out of the Machismo character, it was a backstage segment with Hogan where Hogan told Lethal to get more serious and become a main event player. There was a ton of interaction there which lead to Lethal's push. Why did Lethal's push end? Who the heck knows. They made him X-Division champion, but once Robbie E came in it was a complete jobfest. Does Robbie E sound like someone Hogan would back over Lethal? Robbie has Russo's fingerprints all over it.
TNA has been accused of not pushing talent for years. Why is Hogan getting blamed, and not the man who has beaten Samoa Joe, Matt Morgan, Kurt Angle, and RVD without taking a clean loss since October? That man would be Jeff Jarrett, by the way. The same man who 1) is loved by Vince Russo dating back to WCW, and 2) has been the forefront of TNA since it started up. Suddenly Hogan gets blamed for vets getting pushed and young talent getting released when he has been on the job for a year, missed a lot of time with back injuries, and we don't have a clue what his role in the company (outside of on-screen talent) actually is? That is ridiculous.
Interacting with Hogan and Flair gave Lethal the biggest exposure of his entire career. Why one of them (Hulk) is now the reason for Lethal's demise is baffling to me. Russo, as far as I know, is still writing for them. He is the master of yo-yo booking.
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Post by GaTechGrad on Apr 27, 2011 23:11:28 GMT -5
Before Hogan and Bischoff arrived, Lethal was losing to Jim Niedhart and Tatanka in legends challenges. I would say that Lethal's career was elevated once the new regime arrived, as pointed out by other people in this thread.
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Post by wcw on Apr 27, 2011 23:45:18 GMT -5
Before Hogan and Bischoff arrived, Lethal was losing to Jim Niedhart and Tatanka in legends challenges. I would say that Lethal's career was elevated once the new regime arrived, as pointed out by other people in this thread. I don't put the blame for this on Hogan and Bischoff at all. They seemed to like guy. At first he wasn't seen on screen much the first few months they were there. But then they put him in a program with Flair and Fourtune. He really shined in his role and looked to be primed for a push as he was mega over. After that they relegated him to X-Division champ status and he slowly faded. I blame Russo he doesn't get the concept that a push has to be sustained. You can't push a guy for 3 months then put him in a mid card program thinking that he is good. Lethal needed to go somewhere after his program with Flair. But TNA creative aka Russo never has long term planning. Its just who do I want to push this month/week.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2011 9:28:41 GMT -5
Warning - rajah
Take it for what its worth...but I do remember Bischoff saying he was going to start really featuring the XDivision and it never came to fruition like so many other Bischoff quotes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2011 9:29:29 GMT -5
Wow. Jay Lethal gets released by TNA and posters still find a way to blame and bash Hogan for the decision as if he had any say in it. Since many of you seem to be so hip to TNA's finances, booking team, etc, can anyone actually tell me the structure of the company? Who is in charge? Who makes talent decisions? Who makes financial decisions? Who books the storylines? Other than the latter, which appears to be Russo by all indications, no one has a clue who is involved. Everyone knows who is in charge. We're just not telling you so you - we don't want to ruin the show for you.
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Post by CrazySting on Apr 28, 2011 10:03:54 GMT -5
On the heels of PWInsider.com breaking the Jay Lethal & TNA parting ways story, several indy promoters emailed the DOI. While we do not know the reason as of press time for his departure, we have heard stories that TNA was screwing up Lethal's independent bookings. TNA raised Lethal's price so high, that independent promotions who were using him could no longer afford him, although Lethal wanted to work for a cheaper price. Lethal would rather work than sit at home, but his high price scared indy promoters.
TNA has been jacking the rates of all their talents in recent months. It would make sense if TNA got anyone over, but TNA has that opposite effect. Just look at the careers of Homicide, Low Ki, Samoa Joe, Christopher Daniels, AJ Styles, etc, guys who were all over and worth their price for indy promoters years ago. TNA killed their stocks with their piss poor booking and management.
It is sad and pathetic, that ROH (and this is not a shot at ROH) could get talents over at the independent level without TV years ago. TNA, who has a national deal, could not. The Samoa Joe of 2004 is worth alot more to indy promoters than the Samoa Joe of now, due to TNA's shitty booking.
Indy promoters who wanted to use Lethal stopped due to the high price. However, some indy promoters told the DOI that they still wanted to use Lethal and when dealing with Lethal directly, were given a lower price. TNA wasn't a fan of that. Even worse, we are now hearing from select promoters that when they tried to book Lethal, TNA's booking office tried to push promoters to book other talents who the office wanted to give bookings to, like Eric Young, Jesse Neal, Abyss, Beer Money, etc. Some promoters were told that Lethal was unavailable for dates, although Lethal wasn't booked.
It's from DOI so it's probably biased. But it matches stuff that's been said about how they deal with outside bookings.
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Post by Andrew is Good on Apr 28, 2011 14:09:39 GMT -5
Aren't DOI strongly associated with Jersey All Pro? My guess is people from that company were complaining, as Lethal was, if I remember correctly, a regular part of those shows, along with Rhino and Homicide. So maybe the promoter giving the info is from there, though anyone who knows more about Jersey All Pro could correct me.
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Post by Chuckie Finster on May 1, 2011 9:42:14 GMT -5
Apparently all the X-Division guys made their feelings known at Lockdown about being under-utilized and the flat-out lie they were told about the revitalization of the division. Lethal was fired to send a message to them.
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Post by Savage Gambino on May 1, 2011 11:46:18 GMT -5
Apparently all the X-Division guys made their feelings known at Lockdown about being under-utilized and the flat-out lie they were told about the revitalization of the division. Lethal was fired to send a message to them. You don't know how much I don't want that to be the case.
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Post by ________ has left the building on May 1, 2011 13:31:15 GMT -5
Apparently all the X-Division guys made their feelings known at Lockdown about being under-utilized and the flat-out lie they were told about the revitalization of the division. Lethal was fired to send a message to them. I remember Bischoff fired Sean Waltman to teach Hall and Nash a lesson. That plan worked out so great.
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Post by gnr123 on May 1, 2011 13:48:23 GMT -5
Apparently all the X-Division guys made their feelings known at Lockdown about being under-utilized and the flat-out lie they were told about the revitalization of the division. Lethal was fired to send a message to them. If I was a X-Divison talent, and I knew they fired Lethal to send a message to me, I would get out of there. No reason to stick around after being lied to. Hell, if I was a TNA talent that hasn't been on television for the last 5 month's, I would leave. No reason ot sit in te back with Fatt Hardy or RVDrugged up is on television. Them saying their going to be put in a more prominate role in the show to be blantely lied to is just sad. Them firing Lethal to prove a point is just stupid in it's own right. Just show's you what kind of guy's TNA management it. Liar's, cheater's, and scum's. You people wonder why I don't what the show anymore.
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Post by Krimzon on May 1, 2011 14:24:29 GMT -5
Apparently all the X-Division guys made their feelings known at Lockdown about being under-utilized and the flat-out lie they were told about the revitalization of the division. Lethal was fired to send a message to them. If that actually happened, and that's the way TNA actually conducts business, f*** this company. They deserve to fail if they treat people that way.
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Post by Jimmy on May 2, 2011 12:08:18 GMT -5
ROH announced Lethal will be on their next iPPV in June.
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Post by pink on May 2, 2011 19:23:27 GMT -5
Damn, this combined with the Daffney lawsuit does not look good on TNA.
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